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NFL '12 Season Thread

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Brady didn't play great, but yes it would be foolish to insinuate that he choked in any way. With 3 superbowl rings and numerous game winning drives, his reputation as being "clutch" is set in stone...The Ravens just have a better team than the Pats, They had a better team then the Pats last year as well...The wild card was just how Flacco would perform, and he has showed up so far in the playoffs this year.

If anybody choked I would say Matty Ice did by clutching his shoulder like a wounded animal down the stretch of the biggest game of his career...but again, I think San Fran was the better team anyways, but Ryan had a golden opportunity to ice that game and couldn't do it .

I think the two best most complete teams made it to the Superbowl so It should be a fun game and enjoyable to watch...A perfect opportunity for Flacco to cement his legacy and prove he is really "elite"...he's beat arguably the two best QBs in the game on this run, so it would be a shame to loose to basically a rookie in Kap. But the Ravens have struggled against mobile QB's like RG3 so it will be interesting to see which team can play their best game when the lights are brightest !

That's the thing about people claiming others are clutch though. It's always colored by the narrative they want to give a small sample of games rather than what reality probably is. It makes a good story and that's why people want to see it that way. In reality good teams that are better than the competition win more often, but they also usually have a pretty good chance of loosing anyhow, and that is often not taken into account. Sometimes things happen and teams win or lose despite being better or worse than whom they play and it's nothing more than that. It's even worse when it's a situation where one game will send you home for the season. People often forget that random variance plays a big part in most sports, and it's that and the players normal skill and talent more than magical pixie dust that makes people play better that makes the outcomes of them. The two best most complete teams were probably the Broncos and the Patriots this year, but like I said, in a series of only one game the better teams less times than not but still often lose. it's just the nature of the game and most sports. I think if you could set up a situation where somehow the Broncos or Patriots could play the Ravens ten times with pretty much all things at the start of their last games being equal the Broncos would win about 8 of them and the Patriots would have won 6 or 7.


About Flacco, unless Flacco can put up at least multiple seasons as one of the few of the greatest QBs in the game, he's not elite. Doing aright in a couple of games doesn't make one elite. (The same also goes for why Eli isn't elite.) If he's ever a top 5 QB for 3, 4, or 5 or more years then I might consider him that. At this point he's not even close and probably will never be. Throughout his career he's been lucky to be considered average so far.
 

Jagger69

Three lullabies in an ancient tongue
All of sudden Everyone is defending one of the NFL's dirtiest players Ed Reed.....GTFO!

No harm no foul.

It has nothing to do with Ed Reed. It could have been any player. Again, I reiterate that if Reed (or anyone for that matter) would have gone cleats-up on Brady under the same circumstances, he would have received a personal foul penalty, likely a fine and perhaps a suspension. Brady does it and it's OK? I call bullshit.
 

BAYAMONXXX

Land Of The Snakes
It has nothing to do with Ed Reed. It could have been any player. Again, I reiterate that if Reed (or anyone for that matter) would have gone cleats-up on Brady under the same circumstances, he would have received a personal foul penalty, likely a fine and perhaps a suspension. Brady does it and it's OK? I call bullshit.

Nope it's not ok what Brady did. maybe they'll give him a fine? But the NFL should give him a warning. and if he ever does that shit again then they should Suspend him.
 
That's the thing about people claiming others are clutch though. It's always colored by the narrative they want to give a small sample of games rather than what reality probably is. It makes a good story and that's why people want to see it that way. In reality good teams that are better than the competition win more often, but they also usually have a pretty good chance of loosing anyhow, and that is often not taken into account. Sometimes things happen and teams win or lose despite being better or worse than whom they play and it's nothing more than that. It's even worse when it's a situation where one game will send you home for the season. People often forget that random variance plays a big part in most sports, and it's that and the players normal skill and talent more than magical pixie dust that makes people play better that makes the outcomes of them. The two best most complete teams were probably the Broncos and the Patriots this year, but like I said, in a series of only one game the better teams less times than not but still often lose. it's just the nature of the game and most sports. I think if you could set up a situation where somehow the Broncos or Patriots could play the Ravens ten times with pretty much all things at the start of their last games being equal the Broncos would win about 8 of them and the Patriots would have won 6 or 7.


About Flacco, unless Flacco can put up at least multiple seasons as one of the few of the greatest QBs in the game, he's not elite. Doing aright in a couple of games doesn't make one elite. (The same also goes for why Eli isn't elite.) If he's ever a top 5 QB for 3, 4, or 5 or more years then I might consider him that. At this point he's not even close and probably will never be. Throughout his career he's been lucky to be considered average so far.


I agree that some amount of random variance does play a role in everything, including sports...If you look at Brady, there was certainly unforseen and unpredictable circumstances such as being drafted by the Pats in the sixth round, the "Tuck Rule", and Drew Bledsoe's injury that helped propel Brady into the spotlight, but once he got there, he proved immediately that he was a special player destined for greatness. His reputation of being clutch is based on his plethora of accomplishments extending throughout his whole career, and not through just a small sample of games.

In Brady's career as a starter, the Patriots have won three Super Bowls and gone to five. He has also won two Super Bowl MVP awards, has been selected to eight Pro Bowls, and holds the NFL record for most touchdown passes in a single regular season. His playoff win total is the highest in NFL history. He also helped set the record for the longest consecutive win streak in NFL history with 21 straight wins over two seasons (2003–04), and in 2007 he led the Patriots to the first undefeated regular season since the institution of the 16-game schedule. In 2012, Brady became the first quarterback in NFL history to lead his team to 10 division titles.

Brady and Joe Montana are the only two players in NFL history to win the NFL Most Valuable Player and Super Bowl MVP awards multiple times. Brady and John Elway are the only two quarterbacks to lead their teams to five Super Bowls. He was also named the NFL MVP in 2007 and 2010 (becoming the first player to be unanimously chosen as MVP in the 2010 season) .In beating the Texans, Brady surpassed Joe Montana for the most postseason wins (17) for a quarterback in NFL history,

I agree there is no magical pixie dust that makes him clutch and one of the greatest QB's ever, but also his skill and talent are far beyond just normal. Plus he has the intangible traits of having great heart, and being a great leader of men. Those are two things that really can't be taught.

As far as the most complete teams, I agree Denver had a good team, but I think the most complete teams are San Fran and The Ravens...especially when it comes to their respective recieving cores and their defenses. True, the Ravens were lucky to win against Denver, But I think the Ravens have the better overall talent on offense and defense, Denver just had a better QB in Peyton Manning. But I think if you put Tom Brady on the Ravens, instead of Flacco ( I agree he and Eli are not yet elite), with Anquan Boldin, Torrey Smith, Ray Rice, Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suggs, Ngata and the rest, they would have CRUSHED Denver. That's why, like I said, Flacco was the wild card, and he made some big throws down the stretch that caught Denver somewhat off-gaurd.

IMO The Pats team is a joke compared to the talent they had during the championship years when Brady was surrounded by HOF caliber players such as Willie McGinest DE, Richard Seymour DT, Ty Law CB, Lawyer Milloy SS, 33 Kevin Faulk RB, David Givens R, David Patten, Tedy Bruschi ILB, Mike Vrabel OLB, Matt Light T, Asante Samuel, Rodney Harrison, etc....Now he has nothing on defense, no running game, and Welker and Brandon Lloyd are his top recievers...It's a miracle and testament to Brady's greatness that the Pats have even manged to do as well as they've done the last few years.

Likewise, IMO, San Fran has a pretty formidable roster on Offense with Kap, Crabtree, Vernon Davis, Randy Moss, Mario Manningham, etc..plus a rock solid defense.

On Denver, I like Moreno and Stokley and McGahee, when he was healthy....Dummervil and Porter are decent but Champ Bailey was getting repeatedly torched by Torrey Smith, and that pathetic defense on the last drive cost Denver the game.

As for a scenario where the Ravens would play Denver or the Pats best of 10. Defense wins championships IMO so I might say a 5/5 split with Denver if Flacco plays like he has in the last few games. I would probably go 5/5 with the Pats also, especially since over the past few years Tom, and the Pats, have had problems with tough defenses like the Giants and Ravens.
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Wes Welker's wife goes in on Ray Lewis.
She shouldn't have to aploogize for this, she told the truth.
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2013/01/wes_welkers_wif.html

I don't recall anyone accusing her of lying. But everyone knows that this is just sour grapes because her hubby and his team got their asses kicked at home in front of a sellout crowd. I find it extremely hilarious that if it wasn't for her husband coming down with a case of the slippy fingers these last two postseasons, the Patriots would be working on Lombardi #5 in a few weeks.
 
I haven't seen a lot of the NFL this season. But from what I have, I hard it hard to see how how the Ravens are going to stop SF's with that read-option offence (offense). Some of my friends were telling me about the game against Seattle, but I don't know. Regarding Brown's sabotage comments, I'm not sure he may've meant that. From what I've read, it may be valid that Callahan didn't put in 100% effort to win, mainly from reading Charlie Garner's reaction. It's pretty odd they they didn't change the code for the plays in preparation of the game, I have no idea what happened there. The Patriots have their share of bandwagon supporters in Australia too, I hate them like most normal people.
 
I agree that some amount of random variance does play a role in everything, including sports...If you look at Brady, there was certainly unforseen and unpredictable circumstances such as being drafted by the Pats in the sixth round, the "Tuck Rule", and Drew Bledsoe's injury that helped propel Brady into the spotlight, but once he got there, he proved immediately that he was a special player destined for greatness. His reputation of being clutch is based on his plethora of accomplishments extending throughout his whole career, and not through just a small sample of games.

In Brady's career as a starter, the Patriots have won three Super Bowls and gone to five. He has also won two Super Bowl MVP awards, has been selected to eight Pro Bowls, and holds the NFL record for most touchdown passes in a single regular season. His playoff win total is the highest in NFL history. He also helped set the record for the longest consecutive win streak in NFL history with 21 straight wins over two seasons (2003–04), and in 2007 he led the Patriots to the first undefeated regular season since the institution of the 16-game schedule. In 2012, Brady became the first quarterback in NFL history to lead his team to 10 division titles.

Brady and Joe Montana are the only two players in NFL history to win the NFL Most Valuable Player and Super Bowl MVP awards multiple times. Brady and John Elway are the only two quarterbacks to lead their teams to five Super Bowls. He was also named the NFL MVP in 2007 and 2010 (becoming the first player to be unanimously chosen as MVP in the 2010 season) .In beating the Texans, Brady surpassed Joe Montana for the most postseason wins (17) for a quarterback in NFL history,

I agree there is no magical pixie dust that makes him clutch and one of the greatest QB's ever, but also his skill and talent are far beyond just normal. Plus he has the intangible traits of having great heart, and being a great leader of men. Those are two things that really can't be taught.

As far as the most complete teams, I agree Denver had a good team, but I think the most complete teams are San Fran and The Ravens...especially when it comes to their respective recieving cores and their defenses. True, the Ravens were lucky to win against Denver, But I think the Ravens have the better overall talent on offense and defense, Denver just had a better QB in Peyton Manning. But I think if you put Tom Brady on the Ravens, instead of Flacco ( I agree he and Eli are not yet elite), with Anquan Boldin, Torrey Smith, Ray Rice, Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suggs, Ngata and the rest, they would have CRUSHED Denver. That's why, like I said, Flacco was the wild card, and he made some big throws down the stretch that caught Denver somewhat off-gaurd.

IMO The Pats team is a joke compared to the talent they had during the championship years when Brady was surrounded by HOF caliber players such as Willie McGinest DE, Richard Seymour DT, Ty Law CB, Lawyer Milloy SS, 33 Kevin Faulk RB, David Givens R, David Patten, Tedy Bruschi ILB, Mike Vrabel OLB, Matt Light T, Asante Samuel, Rodney Harrison, etc....Now he has nothing on defense, no running game, and Welker and Brandon Lloyd are his top recievers...It's a miracle and testament to Brady's greatness that the Pats have even manged to do as well as they've done the last few years.

Likewise, IMO, San Fran has a pretty formidable roster on Offense with Kap, Crabtree, Vernon Davis, Randy Moss, Mario Manningham, etc..plus a rock solid defense.

On Denver, I like Moreno and Stokley and McGahee, when he was healthy....Dummervil and Porter are decent but Champ Bailey was getting repeatedly torched by Torrey Smith, and that pathetic defense on the last drive cost Denver the game.

As for a scenario where the Ravens would play Denver or the Pats best of 10. Defense wins championships IMO so I might say a 5/5 split with Denver if Flacco plays like he has in the last few games. I would probably go 5/5 with the Pats also, especially since over the past few years Tom, and the Pats, have had problems with tough defenses like the Giants and Ravens.
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Tom Brady will never be as great as Joe Montana, he can have all the records he wants but none of them will ever offset the fact hes lost 2 Super Bowls, Montana lost none. Hes been exactlt average in his last 14 playoff games (7-7) after winning his first 10. Hes played long enough by now that some teams who have the right player personnal have figured him and the Pats scheme out, the Ravens have had his number the most of anyone.
 
I really hate the bye week before the Super Bowl. :mad:

I have always hated the bye week, and the 3 hour pregame as well. I see no need at all to have longer than a 90 minute pregame (since it is a special and long anticipated game). All it does is rehash stories that have been told to death all season.
 
Jets owner talkin about trading Revis.

They are way overcapped, they have a major QB problem and they have changed GMs. The jets have decisions to make. They cant franchise Revis as per terms of his contract, hes their only worthy player and he wants to get payed. How would anyone like to be the GM here.
 
They are way overcapped, they have a major QB problem and they have changed GMs. The jets have decisions to make. They cant franchise Revis as per terms of his contract, hes their only worthy player and he wants to get payed. How would anyone like to be the GM here.

I wonder if the 9ers could swing Smith and picks for him. Denver could also use him after Bailey got burned all game. Move Champ to FS.
 
and Revis was shocked when he heard this. The Jets will have many suitors for Revis but will they really trade their best defensive player? i tend to doubt it
 
I love how the ravens are underdogs AGAIN.. 3 straight weeks vegas said we would lose (not to mention the 9+ point underdogs against denver and new england) .. Well I guess vegas must really like to be wrong, because we're winning this game
 
I love how the ravens are underdogs AGAIN.. 3 straight weeks vegas said we would lose (not to mention the 9+ point underdogs against denver and new england) .. Well I guess vegas must really like to be wrong, because we're winning this game

It's not about underdogs, it's about how much money gets bet for each team. Vegas (sports books) want as close to 50% of the money bet on each side.
 
The only people who worry about the Vegas line are the betters looking to make money and teams who think the world hates them. When the game kicks off the spread is not going to matter, just the way the teams play.
 
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