War, what is it good for?

[Little Red Wagon Repairman]

View attachment 1006530

This just seems wrong

Don't do it, dude. Ever see Birthday Girl? Leave Svetlana in the refugee camp so she can turn tricks to dumb Polaks.

 

[tvstrip]

https://www.reuters.com/world/uss-blinken-speaks-ukraine-counterpart-poland-blasts-2022-11-16/
U.S.'s Blinken speaks to Ukraine counterpart on Poland blasts

https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...eting-national-security-committee-2022-11-15/
Polish premier calls urgent meeting of national security committee

Oh boy. If it turns out that Russia is behind those blasts in Poland, this shit just got kicked up to the next level.

 

[gmase]

The Ukrainian anti-missile defenses may have been the culprit here. This is a great example of how a simple mistake or miscalculation could have escalated the situation. The longer this goes on the odds of an outlier worse than this happening increase.

Some cooler heads need to prevail here quickly. Negotiate and begin rebuilding - while it can still get rebuilt.

https://www.npr.org/2022/11/16/1137...the-missile-strike-appears-to-be-from-ukraine

 

[tvstrip]

The Ukrainian anti-missile defenses may have been the culprit here. This is a great example of how a simple mistake or miscalculation could have escalated the situation. The longer this goes on the odds of an outlier worse than this happening increase.

Some cooler heads need to prevail here quickly. Negotiate and begin rebuilding - while it can still get rebuilt.

https://www.npr.org/2022/11/16/1137...the-missile-strike-appears-to-be-from-ukraine

Seeing how even Zelenskyy isn't pouncing on this, I'd say you're right. Looks like we've avoided direct NATO engagement... for now.

 

[Luxman]

BRUTAL BOMBING CAMPAIGN LAID WASTE TO TOKYO on March 9, 1945 - AND THAT WAS JUST THE START - Dec 15, 2022
https://www.historynet.com/firebombing-tokyo-curtis-lemay/

 

[tvstrip]

BRUTAL BOMBING CAMPAIGN LAID WASTE TO TOKYO on March 9, 1945 - AND THAT WAS JUST THE START - Dec 15, 2022
https://www.historynet.com/firebombing-tokyo-curtis-lemay/

This is telling:

“If we lose,” the general confided in an aide, “we’ll be tried as war criminals.”
...
Victory guaranteed that LeMay’s earlier fears of possible prosecution for war crimes never materialized. Even with the passage of time, the general’s views never softened, nor did he ever express remorse. “We scorched and boiled and baked to death more people in Tokyo on that night of 9-10 March,” he said years later

I hope lemay is burning in hell with Hitler as his roommate. IMO he orchestrated just as atrocious a holocaust.

 

[Mr. Daystar]

BRUTAL BOMBING CAMPAIGN LAID WASTE TO TOKYO on March 9, 1945 - AND THAT WAS JUST THE START - Dec 15, 2022
https://www.historynet.com/firebombing-tokyo-curtis-lemay/

I don't even have to watch that, to know what it's about. I know it was horrible, but they started it, and Yamamoto said it best. "We have awoken a terrible giant, and filled him with resolve"., and that's exactly what happened. I don't know if you are aware of this, but the army air corps, at the time, was experimenting with weaponizing bats, or pigeons, so they could deliver small fire starting devices. We killed a lot on innocent civilians during WWII, and it's unfortunate, but it was a WORLD war, As time moved on, policies, and tactics changed, so far in fact, that lawyers pick the targets now. But when it happens again, and it will, the next world war will be the same. There will be no rules, there will be no compassion. Just death and suffering....because man, is inherently evil, and a scourge on this planet.

 

[Theopolis Q. Hossenffer]

Regarding the Japanese in WWII. Remember who started it. And how and when and why they started it. And how they treated defeated countries and surrendering enemies. Don't start that evil America bullshit. Japan could have given up at any time or sued for peace it they felt they wanted to. They chose not too. The Japanese(and German also) peoples deaths are as much on their Rulers as anyone else. I don't hear about the Evil Ukrainians hurting and killing poor innocent Russians do I?

 

[tvstrip]

Say someone smaller & weaker than you suckerpunches you on the street. You're big & tough enough to beat them in a fistfight. But instead of fighting them, you go back home, grab your AR-15's and a can of gasoline, drive over to the guy's house, murder them and their entire family (who had nothing to do with this) and burn their house to the ground.

Your "reasoning" is that you could have fought & beat them without using the guns & gasoline, but it would have taken longer and you probably would have taken some punches and gotten hurt yourself along the way. And anyways, they "deserved it" for starting it in the first place.

I think you catch my drift. WWII was not a battle of "good vs evil", just look at "good guys" who emerged from the conflict - Russia & China, among others. Allies also raped and massacred surrendering soliders and civilians. There was no "good" side - everyone was fucked up - war does that to you.

Anyways, I'd rather keep this thread on current wars, so let's try to keep it on that. Feel free to start a historical topic if you like.
But there are more than plenty of wars and conflicts going on in the world today that we don't need open up wars from over 70 years ago in this thread.
Thanks,

 

[Mr. Daystar]

Well, I'll tell you this Strip, if you get in any kind of fight, and then go away to retrieve a weapon of any kind, and go back to the person and use it, that's considered premeditation, Depending on the State, that's either life without parole, or the death penalty.

As far as your analogy goes, I know what you're saying, but we never set out to take innocent lives, Germany most certainly, and also Russia. Stalin was as bad as Hitler, if not worse, and the reason Japan treated prisoners the way they did, was because they saw anyone that did not fight to the death, as a coward, because they did fight to the death. It was more honorable to die for the cause, then to live and fight another day.

The biggest reason so many innocent civilians were killed is far more simple though. Our weapons technology was non existent, as compared to today. They had no choice but to empty 15 or 20 B17's on a target area, just so we had a chance of hitting it. But we can also thank some of those German scientists, because their work on Hitler's missile programs, paved our way to the Moon, and likely helped develop smart weapons.

 

[gmase]

Pardon the further intrusion of past conflicts still being adjudicated:
https://apnews.com/article/prisons-dceae7a28dfdee9a869bd8fe8a75c91a

Irmgard was a cog in the wheel by completing the paperwork at a concentration camp. At 97 she got a 2-year suspended sentence after being tried in juvenile court (she was 18 when the crimes were committed). She actually tried to flee last year prior to being arrested. Great grandma on the lam.

 

[tvstrip]

Pardon the further intrusion of past conflicts still being adjudicated:
https://apnews.com/article/prisons-dceae7a28dfdee9a869bd8fe8a75c91a

Irmgard was a cog in the wheel by completing the paperwork at a concentration camp. At 97 she got a 2-year suspended sentence after being tried in juvenile court (she was 18 when the crimes were committed). She actually tried to flee last year prior to being arrested. Great grandma on the lam.

I think we can make an exception on the wackiness of trying a 97 year-old in juvenile court.

Gross nonetheless noted Tuesday that she could have resigned from her position at any time.

I highly doubt this. First, I'm pretty sure employment in the nazi regime is close to, if not actually conscription. I'm sure you couldn't quit working at Auschwitz by giving 2 weeks notice.

Even worse, the judge found that she knew of the killings. If that was the case, you can't reasonably argue that nazi HR would just let a witness to a literal holocaust into the wild. That is truly “simply beyond all imagination”.

Coincidentally, Canada had a similar case that just "concluded" last year:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Oberlander
He was also a teen (17), and his duties were limited to listening to and translating Russian radio transmissions, acting as an interpreter during interactions between the military and the local population. He became a Canadian citizen, but had it revoked 60 years later when they discovered he forgot to mention he worked at the camp and finally got through the legal process. But he died last year before he could be deported.

 

[tvstrip]

Back to our regularly scheduled program...

Zelenskyy preparing to visit DC, after tour of war’s front
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-zelenskyy-kyiv-9b7d42d3897185c0ecff222e5149e4ea

Insane they would announce this ahead of time. When POTUS visits the troops, everything is kept under lock & key for obvious reasons. Russia regularly fires missiles, I'm sure that includes those than can shoot down planes. And we know there are active spies in the US. Unless they have a way of teleporting him to capitol hill, publishing this was a bone-head move.

 

[Theopolis Q. Hossenffer]

I have read that as advancing Allied armies in WWII (Russian as well as Western ones) approached the camps the guards had fled the camp. i never heard of any of them being hunted down by the Nazi Overlords and being killed for knowing too much. I suspect the Nazis had other things on their mind's. They did order prisoners' marched for miles to try to escape the advancing armies and I suspect some prisoners were killed by the guards but not the Big Wigs.

 

[Luxman]

The Islamist way of war
https://markhumphrys.com/islamist.war.html

All those idiots killed themselves because they were brainwashed to believe the fake 72 virgins bullshit fantasy.
You don't need religion to believe in God. All religions are blasphemous to God.
All religions were corrupted by greedy assholes to manipulate and control people.

"Religion destroyed my faith in God. Science restored my faith in God."

 

[tvstrip]

Ukraine to replace defence minister in wartime reshuffle, top lawmaker says
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...-being-replaced-presidential-ally-2023-02-05/

In recent weeks his own defence ministry became embroiled in a corruption scandal over an army food contract that envisaged paying vastly inflated prices. It caused a public outcry.
One of his deputy ministers has been fired, and two other senior officials have also since left their posts.
The scandal prompted Zelenskiy to embark on a major reshuffle that saw the exit of an array of regional governors, deputy ministers and other officials.

This should give pause to giving carte blanche for military aid to Ukraine. They're not immune from corruption.

Also makes you wonder what they'll do with all the stuff we gave them that's left over when this is done.

 

[gmase]

This should give pause to giving carte blanche for military aid to Ukraine. They're not immune from corruption.

If corruption was an issue, the US DoD wouldn't get much funding. It comes with the territory.

Also makes you wonder what they'll do with all the stuff we gave them that's left over when this is done.

Eventually use it against us? Think back to western support for the Afghan resistance to the Soviets. It came back to bite the west.

 

[tvstrip]

If corruption was an issue, the US DoD wouldn't get much funding. It comes with the territory.

It bugs me that it's starting to look like those "feed the staving kids in Africa" schemes where the majority of money goes to either the corrupt government or the "aid" organization itself. I'm feeling that allied support for the war is going to collapse before the russian economy does. I know my enthusiasm is waning.

Eventually use it against us? Think back to western support for the Afghan resistance to the Soviets. It came back to bite the west.

Or sell it to other countries for profit. Germany had the right to restrict subsequent reexporting of those Leopards by NATO countries, but I'm not seeing any restrictions for the Ukrainians. Even if there were, it's not like they would be bound by such restrictions.

 

[tvstrip]

Ukraine's Zelensky sacks top official as the clean-up drive continues amid war
https://www.wionews.com/world/ukrai...-the-clean-up-drive-continues-amid-war-561063

Zelensky dismissed Ruslan Dziuba as deputy commander of the National Guard. However, the Ukrainian president didn't give any reasons for the action.

Another top official sacked. And again, defence-related.

There seems to be a reason for these - to "drain the swamp" so to speak:

On one side, Zelensky has lobbied allies to supply modern weapons to tackle Russian forces, and on the other, he has stressed the need for the defence ministry in particular to be cleaned up.
He did not specifically mention Dziuba in his daily video address, but it can be seen as a move towards realising his aim to join the European Union as the EU says addressing corruption is a requirement for Ukraine to join the 27-member bloc.

Tl;dr:
Ukraine's government is corrupt, but they're trying to fix it &
They're still interested in joining the EU

 

[tvstrip]

Blinken: Crimea a ‘red line’ for Putin as Ukraine weighs plans to retake it
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/02/15/blinken-crimea-ukraine-putin-00083149

According to four people with knowledge of Blinken’s response, he conveyed that the U.S. isn’t actively encouraging Ukraine to retake Crimea, but that the decision is Kyiv’s alone. The administration’s main focus is helping Ukraine advance where the fight is, mainly in the east

So that's interesting. Now the concern is that the war is going too well, and that it might not be in the best interest to push them too far.

It's true though. Regardless of Crimea legitimately belonging to Ukraine, if putsky thinks he would actually lose land from before starting the war, that will be sure to set him off.