Is Bush the worst president ever?

[logan45]

Re: I agree this is true and a major problem ...

People failed themselves, and now everything is failing as a result.
With the tax payer picking up the check, which will mean those responsible who are left. [/QUOTE]

This is what I've been trying to convey to my friends on the left forever. Life isn't about handouts and depending on a government to tell you how to live your life. If you fuck up then you should be the one picking up the pieces, not your neighbor or people you'll never meet. The housing crisis is the cause of every economic problem we are now facing. Greedy banks handing out loans to stupid people who think that taking an ARM loan when they don't have the money is what started everything. Bush had nothing to do with it, regardless of how much you dislike him. Blame the boards of the large banks, I do. Blame the morons who took out enormous loans when they knew upfront that once the ARM is up on the loan that they were screwed, I do.

I voted with great enthusiasm for Bush the first time, and voted for him the second time simply because there was no other option. I do not think he will go down as a great president, but I certainly do not think he will go down as one of the worst. He was handed a volatile situation when he took over after Clinton. We had every opportunity to kill Bin Laden, but Clinton didn't do it. To be a leader you have to do what is sometimes unpopular, but that does not make it wrong. How many times was the US attacked and we came back with a weak response, i.e- firing Tomahawk missiles?? If you want to defend your country you don't slap your enemy on the wrist, you kill the bastard wherever he lives. War is a terrible thing, and yes, innocent people die in war. I do think we should have locked down with Afghanistan first and then moved on the Iraq, Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up there. But do you honestly think that Gore or Kerry would have had the backbone to go to war? I don't. They would have cried to the UN asking what we should do.

 

[hiimrudd]

Re: I agree this is true and a major problem ...

People failed themselves, and now everything is failing as a result.
With the tax payer picking up the check, which will mean those responsible who are left.

This is what I've been trying to convey to my friends on the left forever. Life isn't about handouts and depending on a government to tell you how to live your life. If you fuck up then you should be the one picking up the pieces, not your neighbor or people you'll never meet. The housing crisis is the cause of every economic problem we are now facing. Greedy banks handing out loans to stupid people who think that taking an ARM loan when they don't have the money is what started everything. Bush had nothing to do with it, regardless of how much you dislike him. Blame the boards of the large banks, I do. Blame the morons who took out enormous loans when they knew upfront that once the ARM is up on the loan that they were screwed, I do.

I voted with great enthusiasm for Bush the first time, and voted for him the second time simply because there was no other option. I do not think he will go down as a great president, but I certainly do not think he will go down as one of the worst. He was handed a volatile situation when he took over after Clinton. We had every opportunity to kill Bin Laden, but Clinton didn't do it. To be a leader you have to do what is sometimes unpopular, but that does not make it wrong. How many times was the US attacked and we came back with a weak response, i.e- firing Tomahawk missiles?? If you want to defend your country you don't slap your enemy on the wrist, you kill the bastard wherever he lives. War is a terrible thing, and yes, innocent people die in war. I do think we should have locked down with Afghanistan first and then moved on the Iraq, Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up there. But do you honestly think that Gore or Kerry would have had the backbone to go to war? I don't. They would have cried to the UN asking what we should do.[/QUOTE]

hindsight is 20/20 :fight:W is still a bonehead !

 

[Member2019]

It's nice to see ...

It's nice to see people here not just making blind, political arguments, but actually stopping to understand the root causes.
I have hope for the future, even if it's going to be very, very rocky and far from pleasant.
But we've been heading down this road for some time, and it didn't just start with W. or Clinton either.

 

[LBP 76]

He is the worst in 100 years. Beyond that, I don't know.

However, anyone that depends on a non-direct relative to look out for their best interests is ridiculously naive. Yes, Bush is a pathetically bad President. And Obama/McCain will be better. But not good enough. The present U.S. political system is purely self serving and must be fundamentally changed if America is to permanently reverse the decay which is starting to envelope it.

You want it fixed? Then get off your asses and do something instead of expecting others to do it for you. Because they won't. Why should they? They are getting all the power/money they need now at your expense. Why would they change it?

 

[Friday on my mind]

Bush and you can argue its circumstances that he could not control(but that doesn't really matter ultimately as he has to take whatever good or bad cards he was dealt) is EASILY right now worst since at least Herbert Hoover early in the last century and the case for that gets better every day now.The only thing that might save him from the title of worst ever is how bad things are in the future as I think its very possible the next president could take the title right or wrongly if things keep getting worse.Probably not a great time to want to be President right now lol.

 

[LBP 76]

Bush and you can argue its circumstances that he could not control(but that doesn't really matter ultimately as he has to take whatever good or bad cards he was dealt) is EASILY right now worst since at least Herbert Hoover early in the last century and the case for that gets better every day now.The only thing that might save him from the title of worst ever is how bad things are in the future as I think its very possible the next president could take the title right or wrongly if things keep getting worse.Probably not a great time to want to be President right now lol.

The only reason I think he is not the worst ever is because I know little about all the Prez's before Lincoln. But it astounds me how horrible Bush has been. Even more so since his father did a reasonably good job.
But the masses re-elected him. They have no one to blame but themselves for whatever he did after 2004. No one.

 

[titsrock]

Re: I agree this is true and a major problem ...

But do you honestly think that Gore or Kerry would have had the backbone to go to war? I don't. They would have cried to the UN asking what we should do.

Seeing as Gore and Kerry both wore the Uniform of our Military into Combat and Chickenhawk Cowards like Bush/Cheney/Rummy/Wolfy/Rice did not...going to the UN doesn't seem like a bad idea in hindsight. It would've been cheaper than dropping $1Trill, right? Oh, wait, we did go to the UN and Saddam, as it turns out, DIDNT have WMD nor did he have anything to do with Osama, al Qaeda or 9/11...it seems the only problem with the UN is that they roll over when our Chest-thumping, chickenhawk coward, cowboy drunks lie to them (Colin Powell excepted).

Since the Republicans thought that John Kerry, a decorated military man, was a fair target to "smear"...I have no problem if the Dems or Moveon.org want to "question" the competence of John McCain on Foreign Policy issues. The guy is too stupid to know that Czechoslovakia DOESN'T EXIST TODAY AND HASN'T SINCE 1993!!! He doesn't know shit about Sunni or Shiite. He thinks "touring" a single Baghdad street under the cover of Blackhawk copters and Marine Tanks and Humvees is "a safe street like any in America"...I mean...SERIOUSLY...he may not have the mental competency to be president:weeping:

 

[rodfarva]

Bush is the worst President ever. He has ruined the economy, sent thousands of Americans to their deaths for an injust war, implemented the No Child Left Behind Act, which if you ask any educator about they will tell you it's the worst thing to happen to the schooling system ever, and done nothing good of any kind. Not to mention he and his brother rigged the first election. Al Gore went on to win the Nobel Peace Prize for his invaluable work on the global warming issue, and he should have been our President. Too bad. Plus, Bush is just flat out idiotic. He's so stupid. Presidents are supposed to be smart. I guess he was smart enough to fool a lot of Americans into thinking there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and somehow get re-elected. Hopefully America smartens up and elects the leader of change, Barack Obama. Everyone vote. PLEASE!!!

 

[Member2019]

Okay, this is really getting old ...

I won't address other things, but these two (2) really stick out ...

Not to mention he and his brother rigged the first election.

Actually, if you knew anything about the 2000 election, instead of listening to Michael Moore, you'd know it was other Republicans, not Jeb.
Even HBO did a fairly good movie on all the people involved and not one of them was Jeb for a reason.

Jeb recused himself almost immediately as a man with a conflict-of-interest.
If he had not done so, Jeb and Katerine Harris could have ended it almost right then and with an always overriding 2-1 vote over Bill Nelson.

Instead, it got far more complicated, and the lack of any journalistic integrity of Michael Moore is instantly noticeable to most of us who live in Florida and knew what went down.

Al Gore went on to win the Nobel Peace Prize for his invaluable work on the global warming issue

Actually, Al Gore is a politician as well, not a leader, including is environmental stance.
Anyone who knows the first thing about Al Gore knows he's not an environmentalist.

He's 30 years too late on "awareness" and there are a lot of people who consider this to be political.
I mean, if Jimmy Carter only "complained" about Egypt and Israel, but didn't get them to sign an agreement, then he wouldn't have gotten the same prize.

It's the first time the Nobel Peace Prize has been given out for solving nothing, it was a political move.
Even several of my fellow engineers who are Democrats and voted for Gore agree he was wholly undeserving off it compared to many others.

I say that again, compared to countless others, it's a joke to give it to Gore, and many in the science and real environmental community agree.
Gore has been a "do as I say, not do as I do" on the environment, and that's why a lot of people in his home state and region voted AGAINST him.

You should really go to Tennessee sometime, as well as visit Gore's own "investments" and see the "exceptions" they have.

 

[cooldude486]

No, Bush makes the Carter Presidency look successful ...

 

[logan45]

Re: I agree this is true and a major problem ...

Seeing as Gore and Kerry both wore the Uniform of our Military into Combat and Chickenhawk Cowards like Bush/Cheney/Rummy/Wolfy/Rice did not...going to the UN doesn't seem like a bad idea in hindsight. It would've been cheaper than dropping $1Trill, right? Oh, wait, we did go to the UN and Saddam, as it turns out, DIDNT have WMD nor did he have anything to do with Osama, al Qaeda or 9/11...it seems the only problem with the UN is that they roll over when our Chest-thumping, chickenhawk coward, cowboy drunks lie to them (Colin Powell excepted).

Since the Republicans thought that John Kerry, a decorated military man, was a fair target to "smear"...I have no problem if the Dems or Moveon.org want to "question" the competence of John McCain on Foreign Policy issues. The guy is too stupid to know that Czechoslovakia DOESN'T EXIST TODAY AND HASN'T SINCE 1993!!! He doesn't know shit about Sunni or Shiite. He thinks "touring" a single Baghdad street under the cover of Blackhawk copters and Marine Tanks and Humvees is "a safe street like any in America"...I mean...SERIOUSLY...he may not have the mental competency to be president:weeping:

I don't have any problem if MoveOn or anybody else challenges McCain either. I think he should have to prove his stances. But neither do I think that Obama or McCain will make a good president. I don't trust McCain and Obama is merely a mouthpiece for his speech writers. Have you ever heard this man speak when he's not in front of a teleprompter?? He's a bumbling idiot!! He is a junior congressman that is being pushed upon the American people because he is a minority. He has absolutely no qualifications. What has he done??

Kerry and Gore served in the military? Really?? Gore's daddy got a cushy photographer position for him and he NEVER saw action. Kerry is a gutless worm after rolling over on his fellow soldiers.

The UN rolling over under pressure from us chest-thumpers? Did they roll over on Iraq? What help did the UN provide their? Nothing. If you like the UN so much, can you explain why the UN hasn't done anything of measure in Darfur, Somalia, etc.? The US under Bush has provided more aid to the African countries than any other country/entity. The UN is absolutely worthless.

Something I have never understood is how the left almost believes that Bush is worse than was Saddam. Oh I'm sure there will be some mindless posts talking about how Bush has killed more than Saddam or he is a war criminal. It's a free country, but you're only showing your stupidity if you try to paint Bush as being worse than Saddam. Let's look at it like this: the WMD thing was a farce, but does that negate the fact that Saddam ran multiple examples of ethnic cleansing, mass murders, using nerve toxins on his own people, etc.? Saddam was a monster and there's no way around it. Bush took care of what needed to be done. I don't agree with the way that he did it, but it's too late now.

 

[bodie54]

Re: I agree this is true and a major problem ...

Kerry is a gutless worm after rolling over on his fellow soldiers.

Rolling over on them how, exactly?

 

[Shower Scene]

The worst...?

No, we've had worse... James Buchanan (1857-1861), president #15

 

[CADDYMAN]

YES

Ok

If one of the global oil companies drills for oil how exactly is that guaranteed that the oil will ever see US soil ?

It is my understanding that prudoe bay oil is just about all exported to of all places Japan.

Ok back to the subject

if for no other reason than he and he alone signed the order to send over 4000 young american men and women over there to die for nothing more than a lie and outright greed.

He should be impeached and imprisoned for these actions and id love to see someone come up with a reason he and everyone else that came up with the cherry picked intel to get americans behind the whole thing should not go to jail for the rest of their lives.

meanwhile back at the Oasis...Osamma bin Laden is still walking the face of this earth.

Mean to tell me that we can read a liscense plate from space and cannot find a 7 foot arab that need kidney dialisis ?

yeah he is the worst and I did not even get close to every idiotic thing he has done

 

[Ceska]

Scholars rank him about average (19th to 23rd).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_United_States_Presidents
Just below Bill Clinton and Taft and just above Van Buren and Hayes (on average).

But these surveys are only as recent as 2005 - ranking has likely dropped since then.

 

[jdm1943]

freakybastard, you're a fucking retarded retard, haha. First of all, it is evident that you know nothing about U.S politics, or any kind of politics, sooo, stick to porn. Second, the worst president was Jimmy Carter, for numerous reasons. Do you know how much a gallon of gas costs in Sierra Leon??? 18 dollars a gallon! Oh, and...what was the mayor/gov of louisiana doin when katrina happened? can you answer that? Again, stick to porn, and blow me.

 

[silent_blue]

freakybastard, you're a fucking retarded retard, haha. First of all, it is evident that you know nothing about U.S politics, or any kind of politics, sooo, stick to porn. Second, the worst president was Jimmy Carter, for numerous reasons. Do you know how much a gallon of gas costs in Sierra Leon??? 18 dollars a gallon! Oh, and...what was the mayor/gov of louisiana doin when katrina happened? can you answer that? Again, stick to porn, and blow me.

I think that outside the USA Jimmy Carter is well thought of. So how Americans see their presidents may not be how the rest of the world sees America.

These discussions are hopeless.

 

[cooldude486]

I think that W has succeeded in making Carter appear successful, Reagan smart, Clinton honorable, Nixon honest and has even rehabilitated Buchanan's presidency. Bush president? He should be in prison ...

 

[Rattrap]

...so I guess this is the closest thread to put this in...

I've been reading Scott McClellan's What Happened and it's a fascinating read. It really does look personally at Bush during his time as Texas Governor and the President and paints a picture of a man who really did mean well, but suffered from wide-ranging self-delusions.

I recommend it for those who still have any interest in the Bush presidency.

 

[cooldude486]

As President George W. Bush at long last takes his leave, he seeks to re-write the history of his disastrous presidency and to conjure up accomplishments in the empty spaces where these should lie. The President insists he should receive the most credit for protecting America, for keeping it safe against those who would do it harm.

Unfortunately, he fell short here as elsewhere, for the greatest threat to our nation’s well-being was not a two-bit terrorist like bin-Laden, nor a two-bit dictator like Saddam, but rather the President himself. At the end of the day, as they like to say on Wall Street – where now it is truly once and for all the end of the day – the greatest threat to America was the Bush Administration. In his eight uncertain years at the helm, the Bush regime managed to inflict more damage upon our country -- politically, socially, economically – than any foreign adversary could have hoped to achieve. It will no doubt be a generation or more before we can even calculate the full extent of the devastation.

Hiding behind the American flag, brandishing the politics of fear like some sort of prehistoric club upon an uncertain population, Bush and his unlikely team of right-wingers, evangelical Bible-thumpers, recidivist southern racists, anti-science kooks and charlatans, xenophobes and fringe loony-tunes formed a surprising alliance with wealthy Americans on Wall Street and dirt poor folks on Tobacco Road. This was to be the only true accomplishment of the Bush Administration, to – eerily similar to the defunct communist parties of the 20th century – achieve and maintain power, for better or worse.

And for us, it was to be the worse.

It was not just that the ideology he stood upon was a wobbly platform that was no less than an anathema to American ideals, but more critically that he wielded his authority with such consistent incompetence that he failed to deliver anything substantive even for those he purported to represent. And let us not forget the lives – thousands of American lives, tens of thousands of Iraqi lives – that fell victim to his shaky hand on the wheel. Our collision with the twin menaces of Nazi Germany and the Empire of Japan more than sixty years ago made us a stronger nation in the end. We went up against far more feeble opponents this time around in Iraq and Afghanistan, and it is we who have come out the weaker.

I remain puzzled by the 22% of Americans who retain support for George W. Bush and claim to miss him when he goes. This is much like a recovered cancer patient who has nostalgia for the excised malignancy. Instead, those of us who have survived partially intact from eight years of the Bush Presidency should look ahead, certain in our conviction that whatever obstacles and pain may lie over the horizon, nothing can exceed the horror that was our recent past.