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Edward Snowden: The Hegelian Dialectic
- Thread starter eric2136
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I'm curious as to how you think NSA, World Bank, CIA, FBI,etc. whistleblowers, such as Edward Snowden, informing you regarding attacks on your civil liberties, especially the 4th amendment, is in some way a conspiracy theory as opposed to a simple factual matter of research and critical thinking.
This thread is on-going because the issue is on-going as evidenced by President Obama's recent press conference on the issue, and the the pending Fourth Amendment Preservation and Protection Act of 2013 .
There are many intelligent people who understand the seriousness of this issue, and have sacrificed alot to make sure that you know some of what is going on in secret around you. You should respect their sacrifices by engaging in intelligent discourse, and not be so flippant regarding important current issues that you unfortunately seem to have choosen to be willfully ignorant of.
Didn't Will Smith and Gene Hackman star in this movie?
Mariahxxx
Official Checked Star Member
yes Eric but you are a long winded conspiracy brother douche bag. you think there are secret societies plotting to nuke all the blacks and that one day anyone without 7 figures in the bank will be exterminated by a group of plaid-wearing country club soldiers.
come on dude. get some help
come on dude. get some help
Edward Snowden is essentially a man without a country and the black helicopters and spies out to get him are real. Hardly a conspiracy theory. Much less so than the George Bush/Dick Cheney masterminded blood for oil campaign that Mariah is alway talking about. LOL @ Mariah Milano. eric was Hegelian Dialect when Hegelian dialect wasn't cool.
Ok now you're just being a racist troll...I know you're better than that....there are 5 pages of info here, you obviously know nothing regarding this topic, so if you're interested, just ask me a question and I'll do my best to answer it.
She doesn't even know what the Hegelian Dialectic is.
NSA files: The Guardian in London forced to destroy hard drives of Snowden leaked files showing the secret collusion between the UK spy agency GCHQ and the NSA, and their ultimate plan to create one worldwide system of surveillance
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/20/nsa-snowden-files-drives-destroyed-london
David Miranda, schedule 7 and the danger that all reporters now face
"...The state...is building such a formidable apparatus of surveillance [and] will do its best to prevent journalists from reporting on it. Most journalists can see that. But I wonder how many have truly understood the absolute threat to journalism implicit in the idea of total surveillance, when or if it comes – and, increasingly, it looks like "when".
We are not there yet, but it may not be long before it will be impossible for journalists to have confidential sources. Most reporting – indeed, most human life in 2013 – leaves too much of a digital fingerprint. Those colleagues who denigrate Snowden or say reporters should trust the state to know best (many of them in the UK, oddly, on the right) may one day have a cruel awakening. One day it will be their reporting, their cause, under attack..."
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/19/david-miranda-schedule7-danger-reporters
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/20/nsa-snowden-files-drives-destroyed-london
David Miranda, schedule 7 and the danger that all reporters now face
"...The state...is building such a formidable apparatus of surveillance [and] will do its best to prevent journalists from reporting on it. Most journalists can see that. But I wonder how many have truly understood the absolute threat to journalism implicit in the idea of total surveillance, when or if it comes – and, increasingly, it looks like "when".
We are not there yet, but it may not be long before it will be impossible for journalists to have confidential sources. Most reporting – indeed, most human life in 2013 – leaves too much of a digital fingerprint. Those colleagues who denigrate Snowden or say reporters should trust the state to know best (many of them in the UK, oddly, on the right) may one day have a cruel awakening. One day it will be their reporting, their cause, under attack..."
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/19/david-miranda-schedule7-danger-reporters
NSA Whistleblower Russ Tice: Rampant Illegal Blackmail Is Creating The Fundamental Basis Of An American Police State
Secret court scolded NSA over surveillance in 2011, declassified documents reveal
The Obama administration acknowledges that a federal judge ordered the NSA to cease its Internet surveillance programs in 2011, ruling the actions unconstitutional.
By Kimberly Dozier and Stephen Braun, The Associated Press
WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration has given up more of its surveillance secrets, acknowledging that it was ordered to stop scooping up thousands of Internet communications from Americans with no connection to terrorism — a practice it says was an unintended consequence when it gathered bundles of Internet traffic connected to terror suspects.
One of the documents that intelligence officials released Wednesday came because a court ordered the National Security Agency to do so. But it's also part of the administration's response to the leaks by analyst-turned-fugitive Edward Snowden, who revealed that the NSA's spying programs went further and gathered millions more communications than most Americans realized.
Advertise | AdChoicesThe NSA declassified three secret court opinions showing how it revealed to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court that one of its surveillance programs may have collected and stored as many as 56,000 emails and other communications by ordinary Americans annually over three years. The court ruled the NSA actions unconstitutional and ordered the agency to fix the problem, which it did by creating new technology to filter out buckets of data most likely to contain U.S. emails, and then limit the access to that data.
The director of national intelligence, James Clapper, released the information Wednesday "in the interest of increased transparency," and as directed by President Barack Obama in June, according to a statement accompanying the online documents.
Emphasizing that NSA leaker Edward Snowden isn't a patriot, President Obama said he had called for a review of surveillance operations well before Snowden leaked any information. The new reforms will call for additional transparency and create a task force of private citizens to review the NSA's surveillance programs. NBC's Chuck Todd reports.
But it wasn't until the Electronic Freedom Foundation, an Internet civil liberties group that sued for the release of one of the documents, disclosed the court order that Obama administration officials also acknowledged that the release was prodded by the group's 2012 lawsuit.
The court opinions show that when the NSA reported its inadvertent gathering of American-based Internet traffic in September 2011, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court ordered the agency to find ways to limit what it collects and how long it keeps the material.
In an 85-page declassified FISA court ruling from October 2011, U.S. District Judge James D. Bates rebuked government lawyers for repeatedly misrepresenting the operations of the NSA's surveillance programs.
Bates wrote that the NSA had advised the court that "the volume and nature of the information it had been collecting is fundamentally different than what the court had been led to believe," and went on to say the court must consider "whether targeting and minimization procedures comport with the Fourth Amendment" prohibition against unreasonable search and seizure.
"This court is troubled that the government's revelations regarding NSA's acquisition of Internet transactions mark the third instance in less than three years in which the government has disclosed a substantial misrepresentation regarding the scope of a major collection program," Bates added in a footnoted passage that had portions heavily blacked out.
Bates also complained that the government's submissions make clear that the NSA was gathering Internet data years before it was authorized by the USA Patriot Act's Section 702 in 2008.
The NSA had moved to revise its Internet surveillance in an effort to separate out domestic data from its foreign targeted metadata — which includes email addresses and subject lines. But in his October 2011 ruling, Bates said the government's "upstream" collection of data — taken from internal U.S. data sources — was unconstitutional.
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...ce-in-2011-declassified-documents-reveal?lite
Secret court scolded NSA over surveillance in 2011, declassified documents reveal
The Obama administration acknowledges that a federal judge ordered the NSA to cease its Internet surveillance programs in 2011, ruling the actions unconstitutional.
By Kimberly Dozier and Stephen Braun, The Associated Press
WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration has given up more of its surveillance secrets, acknowledging that it was ordered to stop scooping up thousands of Internet communications from Americans with no connection to terrorism — a practice it says was an unintended consequence when it gathered bundles of Internet traffic connected to terror suspects.
One of the documents that intelligence officials released Wednesday came because a court ordered the National Security Agency to do so. But it's also part of the administration's response to the leaks by analyst-turned-fugitive Edward Snowden, who revealed that the NSA's spying programs went further and gathered millions more communications than most Americans realized.
Advertise | AdChoicesThe NSA declassified three secret court opinions showing how it revealed to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court that one of its surveillance programs may have collected and stored as many as 56,000 emails and other communications by ordinary Americans annually over three years. The court ruled the NSA actions unconstitutional and ordered the agency to fix the problem, which it did by creating new technology to filter out buckets of data most likely to contain U.S. emails, and then limit the access to that data.
The director of national intelligence, James Clapper, released the information Wednesday "in the interest of increased transparency," and as directed by President Barack Obama in June, according to a statement accompanying the online documents.
Emphasizing that NSA leaker Edward Snowden isn't a patriot, President Obama said he had called for a review of surveillance operations well before Snowden leaked any information. The new reforms will call for additional transparency and create a task force of private citizens to review the NSA's surveillance programs. NBC's Chuck Todd reports.
But it wasn't until the Electronic Freedom Foundation, an Internet civil liberties group that sued for the release of one of the documents, disclosed the court order that Obama administration officials also acknowledged that the release was prodded by the group's 2012 lawsuit.
The court opinions show that when the NSA reported its inadvertent gathering of American-based Internet traffic in September 2011, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court ordered the agency to find ways to limit what it collects and how long it keeps the material.
In an 85-page declassified FISA court ruling from October 2011, U.S. District Judge James D. Bates rebuked government lawyers for repeatedly misrepresenting the operations of the NSA's surveillance programs.
Bates wrote that the NSA had advised the court that "the volume and nature of the information it had been collecting is fundamentally different than what the court had been led to believe," and went on to say the court must consider "whether targeting and minimization procedures comport with the Fourth Amendment" prohibition against unreasonable search and seizure.
"This court is troubled that the government's revelations regarding NSA's acquisition of Internet transactions mark the third instance in less than three years in which the government has disclosed a substantial misrepresentation regarding the scope of a major collection program," Bates added in a footnoted passage that had portions heavily blacked out.
Bates also complained that the government's submissions make clear that the NSA was gathering Internet data years before it was authorized by the USA Patriot Act's Section 702 in 2008.
The NSA had moved to revise its Internet surveillance in an effort to separate out domestic data from its foreign targeted metadata — which includes email addresses and subject lines. But in his October 2011 ruling, Bates said the government's "upstream" collection of data — taken from internal U.S. data sources — was unconstitutional.
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...ce-in-2011-declassified-documents-reveal?lite
NSA surveillance exposed
AP/ September 28, 2013, 10:03 PM
Report: NSA maps out a person's social connections
WASHINGTON For almost three years the National Security Agency has been tapping the data it collects to map out some Americans' social connections, allowing the government to identify their associates, their locations at certain times, their traveling companions and other personal information, The New York Times reported.
Citing documents provided by former NSA systems analyst Edward Snowden, the Times reported that the NSA began allowing the analysis of phone call and e-mail logs in November 2010 to examine some Americans' networks of associations for foreign intelligence purposes after NSA officials lifted restrictions on the practice. The newspaper posted the report on its website Saturday.
Glenn Greenwald working on new NSA revelations
A January 2011 memorandum from the spy agency indicated that the policy shift was intended to help the agency "discover and track" connections between intelligence targets overseas and people in the United States, the Times reported.
The documents Snowden provided indicated that the NSA can augment the communications data with material from public, commercial and other sources, including bank codes, insurance information, Facebook profiles, passenger manifests, voter registration rolls and GPS location information, as well as property records and unspecified tax data, the paper reported.
NSA officials declined to say how many Americans have been caught up in the effort, including people involved in no wrongdoing, the Times reported. The documents do not describe what has resulted from the scrutiny, which links phone numbers and e-mails in a "contact chain" tied directly or indirectly to a person or organization overseas that is of foreign intelligence interest, the paper reported.
The documents provided by Snowden don't specify which phone and e-mail databases are used to create the social network diagrams, the Times reported, and NSA officials wouldn't identify them. However, NSA officials said the large database of Americans' domestic phone call records revealed in June was not used, the paper reported.
Disclosures from documents leaked by Snowden earlier this year have sparked debate over the government's surveillance activities and concerns that Americans' civil liberties have been violated by the data collection. Russia has granted temporary asylum to Snowden, considered a fugitive from justice in the U.S., and his whereabouts remain secret.
© 2013 The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
AP/ September 28, 2013, 10:03 PM
Report: NSA maps out a person's social connections
WASHINGTON For almost three years the National Security Agency has been tapping the data it collects to map out some Americans' social connections, allowing the government to identify their associates, their locations at certain times, their traveling companions and other personal information, The New York Times reported.
Citing documents provided by former NSA systems analyst Edward Snowden, the Times reported that the NSA began allowing the analysis of phone call and e-mail logs in November 2010 to examine some Americans' networks of associations for foreign intelligence purposes after NSA officials lifted restrictions on the practice. The newspaper posted the report on its website Saturday.
Glenn Greenwald working on new NSA revelations
A January 2011 memorandum from the spy agency indicated that the policy shift was intended to help the agency "discover and track" connections between intelligence targets overseas and people in the United States, the Times reported.
The documents Snowden provided indicated that the NSA can augment the communications data with material from public, commercial and other sources, including bank codes, insurance information, Facebook profiles, passenger manifests, voter registration rolls and GPS location information, as well as property records and unspecified tax data, the paper reported.
NSA officials declined to say how many Americans have been caught up in the effort, including people involved in no wrongdoing, the Times reported. The documents do not describe what has resulted from the scrutiny, which links phone numbers and e-mails in a "contact chain" tied directly or indirectly to a person or organization overseas that is of foreign intelligence interest, the paper reported.
The documents provided by Snowden don't specify which phone and e-mail databases are used to create the social network diagrams, the Times reported, and NSA officials wouldn't identify them. However, NSA officials said the large database of Americans' domestic phone call records revealed in June was not used, the paper reported.
Disclosures from documents leaked by Snowden earlier this year have sparked debate over the government's surveillance activities and concerns that Americans' civil liberties have been violated by the data collection. Russia has granted temporary asylum to Snowden, considered a fugitive from justice in the U.S., and his whereabouts remain secret.
© 2013 The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
France threatens Google over data protection breaches
Published September 27, 2013
The CNIL said Google had failed to comply with data protection guidelines within a three-month deadline and said it would begin a formal sanction procedure, under which the US company could be fined up to 150,000 euros ($205,000).AFP/File
Paris (AFP) – France's data protection watchdog said Friday it would take action against US giant Google for failing to comply with national privacy guidelines.
The issue of data protection has gathered steam worldwide following revelations by Edward Snowden, a former contractor with the National Security Agency, that the US had a vast, secret programme called PRISM to monitor Internet users.
France's CNIL said Google had failed to comply with data protection guidelines within a three-month deadline and said it would begin a formal sanction procedure, under which the US giant could be fined up to 150,000 euros ($205,000).
CNIL had asked Google to inform web users in France on how it processes their personal data and to define exactly how long they can store the information.
It had also requested that the US giant obtain users' permission before storing cookies on their computers, referring to files that track netizens and allow companies to target them with tailored commercials.
"On the last day of this (three-month) period, Google responded to the CNIL. Google contests the reasoning of the CNIL and has not complied with the requests laid down in the enforcement notice," the watchdog said in a statement.
"In this context, the Chair of the CNIL will now designate a rapporteur for the purpose of initiating a formal procedure for imposing sanctions."
In its response, Google made no mention of any challenge to CNIL's reasoning and maintained it respects European law.
France's move follows Google's introduction last year of a new privacy policy which enables it to track user activity across its search engine, Gmail, the Google+ social networking platform and other services it owns, which include YouTube.
The changes make it easier for Google to collect and process data that could be used by advertisers to target individuals with offers tailored to their specific interest, thereby increasing the company's revenue potential.
Google has defended the changes it made last year on the ground that they simplify and standardise its approach across its various services.
But critics argue that the policy, which offers no ability to opt out aside from refraining from signing into Google services, gives the operator of the world's largest search engine unprecedented ability to monitor its users.
While always on the agenda, the issue of data protection took on an extra dimension when Snowden's revelations were published in June.
Under PRISM, the National Security Agency can issue directives to Internet firms demanding access to emails, online chats, pictures, files, videos and more.
Since then, keen to dispel any suspicion over their role in the programme, Yahoo, Google, Facebook and others have pushed for permission to disclose more details to users about demands for data made on them in the name of fighting terrorism or other threats.
Published September 27, 2013
The CNIL said Google had failed to comply with data protection guidelines within a three-month deadline and said it would begin a formal sanction procedure, under which the US company could be fined up to 150,000 euros ($205,000).AFP/File
Paris (AFP) – France's data protection watchdog said Friday it would take action against US giant Google for failing to comply with national privacy guidelines.
The issue of data protection has gathered steam worldwide following revelations by Edward Snowden, a former contractor with the National Security Agency, that the US had a vast, secret programme called PRISM to monitor Internet users.
France's CNIL said Google had failed to comply with data protection guidelines within a three-month deadline and said it would begin a formal sanction procedure, under which the US giant could be fined up to 150,000 euros ($205,000).
CNIL had asked Google to inform web users in France on how it processes their personal data and to define exactly how long they can store the information.
It had also requested that the US giant obtain users' permission before storing cookies on their computers, referring to files that track netizens and allow companies to target them with tailored commercials.
"On the last day of this (three-month) period, Google responded to the CNIL. Google contests the reasoning of the CNIL and has not complied with the requests laid down in the enforcement notice," the watchdog said in a statement.
"In this context, the Chair of the CNIL will now designate a rapporteur for the purpose of initiating a formal procedure for imposing sanctions."
In its response, Google made no mention of any challenge to CNIL's reasoning and maintained it respects European law.
France's move follows Google's introduction last year of a new privacy policy which enables it to track user activity across its search engine, Gmail, the Google+ social networking platform and other services it owns, which include YouTube.
The changes make it easier for Google to collect and process data that could be used by advertisers to target individuals with offers tailored to their specific interest, thereby increasing the company's revenue potential.
Google has defended the changes it made last year on the ground that they simplify and standardise its approach across its various services.
But critics argue that the policy, which offers no ability to opt out aside from refraining from signing into Google services, gives the operator of the world's largest search engine unprecedented ability to monitor its users.
While always on the agenda, the issue of data protection took on an extra dimension when Snowden's revelations were published in June.
Under PRISM, the National Security Agency can issue directives to Internet firms demanding access to emails, online chats, pictures, files, videos and more.
Since then, keen to dispel any suspicion over their role in the programme, Yahoo, Google, Facebook and others have pushed for permission to disclose more details to users about demands for data made on them in the name of fighting terrorism or other threats.
apparently he is releasing some more info in the near future
Obama’s NSA Task Force Recommends Major Reforms
Posted 6 hours ago by Gregory Ferenstein (@ferenstein)

Today, the much-anticipated findings of President Obama’s National Security Agency task force have hit the wire [PDF]. The non-binding 200 page report of 40-plus recommendations calls for the end of many of the most controversial programs.
Here are the big takeaways:
1. The government would no longer hold on to phone records in bulk. Instead, phone companies might warehouse the data for individual requests from the government. The recommendations say that the government should only access such data with a specific purpose, so it’s unknown how the NSA would continue to mine networks for patterns — or if it would be allowed to at all.
Here’s the important quote, “We recommend that legislation should be enacted that terminates the storage of bulk telephony meta-data by the government.”
2. Stop undermining global security standards. The NSA likes to maintain undiscovered hacking tools (“zero-day exploits“) and force loopholes in Internet security standards. The work it’s doing to crack basic encryption falls along those lines as well. It helps them monitor more traffic, but makes the web overall a less safe place.
3. No tech company “backdoors”. Google and other major tech companies have vigorously denied that they create special backdoor access for NSA spying, but the report recommends they cease this supposedly non-existent practice anyway. It is unclear whether such backdoors were currently being built out or already in existence.
4. Organizational changes:*The director of the NSA should be confirmed by the Senate and open to civilians, there should be a new privacy board to review strategies, and the secret court should have a special public advocate. This differs from previous leaks to the*Wall Street Journal, which implied that the panel recommend a civilian director.
5. More transparency: The government should disclose the number of users who the NSA has requested to examine.
The panel follows a ******* of new developments, any of which may significantly alter the way U.S. intelligence agencies gather private data en masse. This week, a federal judge declared bulk collection of phone records to be unconstitutional, though the decision will likely have to wait for the Supreme Court’s ruling.
Members of congress aren’t sitting idly by for the courts; several groups have proposed various limitations on U.S. spying, broadly supported by the major tech companies, to end all bulk collection and disclose the number of users being spied on.
The Internet hive mind is collectively combing through the 200 page report. We’ll have more soon.
Posted 6 hours ago by Gregory Ferenstein (@ferenstein)

Today, the much-anticipated findings of President Obama’s National Security Agency task force have hit the wire [PDF]. The non-binding 200 page report of 40-plus recommendations calls for the end of many of the most controversial programs.
Here are the big takeaways:
1. The government would no longer hold on to phone records in bulk. Instead, phone companies might warehouse the data for individual requests from the government. The recommendations say that the government should only access such data with a specific purpose, so it’s unknown how the NSA would continue to mine networks for patterns — or if it would be allowed to at all.
Here’s the important quote, “We recommend that legislation should be enacted that terminates the storage of bulk telephony meta-data by the government.”
2. Stop undermining global security standards. The NSA likes to maintain undiscovered hacking tools (“zero-day exploits“) and force loopholes in Internet security standards. The work it’s doing to crack basic encryption falls along those lines as well. It helps them monitor more traffic, but makes the web overall a less safe place.
3. No tech company “backdoors”. Google and other major tech companies have vigorously denied that they create special backdoor access for NSA spying, but the report recommends they cease this supposedly non-existent practice anyway. It is unclear whether such backdoors were currently being built out or already in existence.
4. Organizational changes:*The director of the NSA should be confirmed by the Senate and open to civilians, there should be a new privacy board to review strategies, and the secret court should have a special public advocate. This differs from previous leaks to the*Wall Street Journal, which implied that the panel recommend a civilian director.
5. More transparency: The government should disclose the number of users who the NSA has requested to examine.
The panel follows a ******* of new developments, any of which may significantly alter the way U.S. intelligence agencies gather private data en masse. This week, a federal judge declared bulk collection of phone records to be unconstitutional, though the decision will likely have to wait for the Supreme Court’s ruling.
Members of congress aren’t sitting idly by for the courts; several groups have proposed various limitations on U.S. spying, broadly supported by the major tech companies, to end all bulk collection and disclose the number of users being spied on.
The Internet hive mind is collectively combing through the 200 page report. We’ll have more soon.
Presidential press conference conducted in response to new and continuing Snowden revelations. Interesting spin on american history and the NSA, however ongoing legal proceedings by the ACLU and others will be necessary to effectuate any real and lasting change in the NSA's illegal surveillance policies.
Here is the real truth of the history of the CIA and the NSA.
Here is the real truth of the history of the CIA and the NSA.
Deepcover
Closed Account
I'm not a pro on this matter but the way I see it is I can see ppl's love and hate for the guy. Snowden is bascially Roman Polanski on the run (Sometimes I wonder how he well sleeps at night) and spill out all the beans. America and Russia keep playing kindergarden games, Snowden is now in purgatory, terrorists now have a huge advantage thanks to the leaks and if Snowden steps on US soil his ass will be fried. So I don't know if he should be tried as a felon or not. Tough call imo
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