Why Obama?

[Friday on my mind]

The reference has a newspaper article about the amount of money Obama wants to give to the world to end "extreme poverty". Why is it our duty? We messed Iraq up, the least we could do is to help put it back together. The "redistribute" that you talk about isn't the same as I am talking about. He wants to give the tax money back to those who pay little to nothing into our system so they can afford to have the same nice things that I, as a fish counter worker, work hard for. I make $9.50 an hour selling fish and meat to pay for what I have. Then I get taxed, then I pay union dues. So, if anything, I am more of a "worker" than not. Why would I not want to have Obama as a president? Because I am not wanting to pay even more so that the bums and lazy asses I see when I ride the bus can have the same things as me without working.

The millenium project to do something about the almost 1/2 of people in the world who live on one dollar a day which is what your talking about is very much in the developed countries interest.It's us that need stability in the world to maintain our lifestyles and access to all the resources we consume that make that lifestyle possible.
That kind of poverty by so many people is a huge threat to stability.You think its tough living on $9.50 an hour (and i'm not saying it isn't) try a dollar a day.Sure we can ignore them for now but eventually they will not be ignored and boy will we pay in many ways then.I won't even get into how we only live so well by getting others resources and explotation cause you would not like hearing it and not beleive it anyway lol.But don't worry at $9.50 an hour you have no wealth to redistribute and would do much better with the tax proposals that Obama has made.You are exactly who he wants to help some by returning the tax rates on the top to what they were under Clinton which is just little more on people making over $250,000 and cutting your taxes.You need to vote your interests which is not being promoted by the republicans who think rich folks always deserve their taxes cut while everyone else falls behind.

 

[ToastedOats]

The millenium project to do something about the almost 1/2 of people in the world who live on one dollar a day which is what your talking about is very much in the developed countries interest.It's us that need stability in the world to maintain our lifestyles and access to all the resources we consume that make that lifestyle possible.
That kind of poverty by so many people is a huge threat to stability.You think its tough living on $9.50 an hour (and i'm not saying it isn't) try a dollar a day.Sure we can ignore them for now but eventually they will not be ignored and boy will we pay in many ways then.I won't even get into how we only live so well by getting others resources and explotation cause you would not like hearing it and not beleive it anyway lol.But don't worry at $9.50 an hour you have no wealth to redistribute and would do much better with the tax proposals that Obama has made.You are exactly who he wants to help some by returning the tax rates on the top to what they were under Clinton which is just little more on people making over $250,000 and cutting your taxes.You need to vote your interests which is not being promoted by the republicans who think rich folks always deserve their taxes cut while everyone else falls behind.

Here's the thing. I'm in college and will someday make much much more money than that. It doesn't suit my future needs to vote for someone who will in turn want to take the money I make in the future away from me. $9.50 an hour pays the rent, for my car, school etc. It pays for my beer, food and whatnot. I make it by, but I don't think I need to share it with the rest of the world just because their countries suck ass.

We live in America, where you can work to make yourself better. It is a shame that so many suck on the American teat only to bad mouth it.

I have a republican interest and a democrat reality. When I join the real world, I will not want to vote democrat. It goes against common sense. Taking from the rich and giving to the poor makes a nice Disney movie, but in reality, the poor are poor for a reason. They haven't been educated on how to make wise financial moves.

 

[thegunner]

Because he's not John McCain.

 

[calpoon]

Coke or Pepsi?

 

[ToastedOats]

Coke

 

[Friday on my mind]

Here's the thing. I'm in college and will someday make much much more money than that. It doesn't suit my future needs to vote for someone who will in turn want to take the money I make in the future away from me. $9.50 an hour pays the rent, for my car, school etc. It pays for my beer, food and whatnot. I make it by, but I don't think I need to share it with the rest of the world just because their countries suck ass.

We live in America, where you can work to make yourself better. It is a shame that so many suck on the American teat only to bad mouth it.

I have a republican interest and a democrat reality. When I join the real world, I will not want to vote democrat. It goes against common sense. Taking from the rich and giving to the poor makes a nice Disney movie, but in reality, the poor are poor for a reason. They haven't been educated on how to make wise financial moves.

All I will say to you is if your in college that means I am about double your age and maybe seen more and know the history of such things maybe a little better.What made this country great was the growth of incomes experienced by the majority of people after WW2.None of that happened by accident,it was concerted policies that brought it about.Just as it has been concerted policies to reverse that trend and confine growth of incomes to a small group at the top for the last few decades,their incomes have exploded while everyone has lost ground.IMO your falling for this republican nonsence about welfare types and class warfare.The only class warfare thats being going on is the few using their clout to make the system work much more for them at the top then the majority.Real wages have been declining for most americans since the 70s.This idea the republicans sell that you might very likely be in the top 1 or 2 percent someday is snake oil,its like telling high school football players they have good shot at being in the NFL someday,its very unlikely.Not even all the wealthy don't see this ,thats why obama is raising so much money.They know kill the middle class and you kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.The rich aren't rich cause they are that much superior to others,please lot of morons are rich and priveledged (just look at GWB) lol.And I'm sorry america takes more from the world then it gives.We are like 3% of the worlds population have about 3% of the worlds oil but consume 25 to 30 percent of world oil production is just one example.

 

[AFA]

Here's the thing. I'm in college and will someday make much much more money than that. It doesn't suit my future needs to vote for someone who will in turn want to take the money I make in the future away from me. $9.50 an hour pays the rent, for my car, school etc. It pays for my beer, food and whatnot. I make it by, but I don't think I need to share it with the rest of the world just because their countries suck ass.

We live in America, where you can work to make yourself better. It is a shame that so many suck on the American teat only to bad mouth it.

I have a republican interest and a democrat reality. When I join the real world, I will not want to vote democrat. It goes against common sense. Taking from the rich and giving to the poor makes a nice Disney movie, but in reality, the poor are poor for a reason. They haven't been educated on how to make wise financial moves.

That's not what's happening here. That's political rhetoric.

They are suggesting in appearances and a probably email distribution that your tax money will go to fund losers on the Obama plan. That's not the case. McCain said the economy was doing well up until about 8 weeks ago when his advisors suggested that wasn't working, and so he has copied a lot of the dem proposals that have been out there for 18 months.

Let me ask you. You believe that your taxes will go to suppliment people making less than $250,000? Welfare recepients and other "lazy" individuals? Then why am I taxed excessively by tradition to suppliment investment banks, US automakers that ship jobs overseas, and corporate execs making many 10-100x more than I do per year? Why should part of my taxes paid, (40%), cover big wigs in corporations who make millions annually, and are greedy enough to keep every dime for themselves. These people are not there because they need to be by an stretch of the imagination. Michael Moore's early film Roger and Me talked about lay offs of workers at GM in MI, shipping jobs overseas, while Roger Smith who devised the plan made a nice bonus. Do you really think these guys into the 10's and 100's of millions of dollars give a crap about any of us?

I have yet to hear McCains's advisors tell him he better show this, but know Obama has been on this from the beginning. You can't watch this election coverage for the long term and not see this shift in McCain policy to suddenly mimic Obama. In another thread, I said it's like Microsoft copying Mac's OS10. It's not the same. although it purposefully looks the same, doesn't do the same thing, and not from the same initiative or motivation. It's a guise, a sleight of hand. Why do I pay tax to support US corporations that pay their execs tens of millions of dollars in subsidies to make bad decisions? When does that stop? Why don't I get a tax break and fuck these guys, a good number of whom should be in jail?

 

[Jagger69]

What kind of question is that? Do you still beat your wife?

Why McCain after why Bush? I knew that administration had no clue pretty fast when pushing the cause for war, so why would anyone not see what to me is blatently obvious and has been for years? :dunno: I think the more information people take in, the clearer it becomes that those guys are not capabile of representing the other 90% of the population.

I've been watching the news every day for years. McCain only developed his new "strategy" and campaign in the past few months, when his clear support of Bush wasn't getting the result of Obama. This is like Microsoft copying yet another MacIntosh OS don't you think?

A good question I might ask, is while McCain hammers away on this poor Joe the Plumber paying hard earned dollars to support illegals, lazy, stupid and underprivledged, why do my hard earned dollars go to congressional dinners, corporate tax cuts, and bonuses for greedy corporate boys, raking in 10's of millions in salary a year?

I was going to make my own comment but I think this pretty much covers it. EXCELLENT post, AFA!

:thumbsup:

 

[Facial_King]

As a non-Obama fan, I must say that his very left wing policies of gun control, socialized health care and "redistribution" are all very marxist. I do not feel like footing the bill for everyone to have coverage, regardless how noble the idea is. In reality it would not be feasible given how much everyone is taxed as it is, and then on top of that the taxes for the health care that Obama wants to give everyone.

Social programs are for the most part a drain on our communities and society as they only give a fake scaffolding and a temporary fix to the many problems that our society has allowed to occur.

Okay, wait a second. I have no qualms with people who haven't taken an undergraduate course in political economics or in some way studied the ideas of Marx. That's fine. Not everyone needs to study that. But it bugs me when people start labeling people and policies as "Marxist" when they are a long, long way from any such thing. It's one thing to say that it's an idea that you disagree with, and to explain why, or even to say that it's too far to the left of your position for you to be comfortable with it, but to smear policy proposals and - more importantly in campaign season - the policy proponents as "Marxist" or "socialist" is just absurd. Let's make the most of this teaching moment, ok??

Start here:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-obama-chicago-socialist,0,4048540.story

and then move on to this:
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2008/oct2008/pers-o23.shtml

The majority of scholarly, principled, well-studied Marxists and socialists hardly feel that Obama is one of their own. If anything, they feel antipathy towards him (as well as Mr. McCain). So, let's knock off the lame, grade-school-level attempts to revive the McCarthy era. The socialists are hardly going to be pleased if Obama gets into the White House.

The reference has a newspaper article about the amount of money Obama wants to give to the world to end "extreme poverty". Why is it our duty? We messed Iraq up, the least we could do is to help put it back together. The "redistribute" that you talk about isn't the same as I am talking about. He wants to give the tax money back to those who pay little to nothing into our system so they can afford to have the same nice things that I, as a fish counter worker, work hard for. I make $9.50 an hour selling fish and meat to pay for what I have. Then I get taxed, then I pay union dues. So, if anything, I am more of a "worker" than not. Why would I not want to have Obama as a president? Because I am not wanting to pay even more so that the bums and lazy asses I see when I ride the bus can have the same things as me without working.

Who handed him his Harvard paid education? How did he pay for all of that stuff? He wasn't from an ordinary family. His family had money too. McCain isn't in my opinion a great candidate, just marginally better.

Your reference links to an unsigned article on the WorldNetDaily site. WorldNetDaily is hardly a newspaper in any sense. It's about as far right as the socialist website that I linked to is left. They don't produce news, they produce reactionary propaganda, pure and simple.

What union are you a member of, ToastedOats? You do realize, no, that Obama has received far more union endorsements than has McCain?

As for Obama's family having money, well, perhaps - most families have some money. I highly doubt that Obama's had as much as McCain's. From humble Wiki:

"Obama entered Harvard Law School in late 1988. At the end of his first year, he was selected, based on his grades and a writing competition, as an editor of the Harvard Law Review.[20] In February 1990, in his second year, he was elected president of the Law Review, a full-time volunteer position functioning as editor-in-chief and supervising the Law Review's staff of eighty editors."

It seems to me that he excelled in his schooling based largely on merit. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find out that he received at least a few merit-based scholarships.

---- As for the original question, I'm inclined to vote for Obama because, while I think that he won't bring nearly the change - in a LEFTward direction - that is needed for the U.S., I do think that whatever he does will represent a slower momentum to America's downfall (as in, off a cliff), as compared to McCain, who is really only promising more war. I'm tempted to vote 3rd party, but I can see that it's really a choice between these two, and for God's sake, we don't need another Republican in the Oval Office, least of all one who has had such a consistently pro-Bush record over the last few years...

btw, Obama wasn't my first choice during the Dem primaries (but neither was Hillary).

 

[lovejoy]

The Government plays a significant role now and back in 1930"s during the recession.

There is no way to tell if Obama will change the fundamental fault of our business how it runs and leads us into this mess.

No one really asks Obama or mcCain will they favour the Government to inject cash flow into GM to buy Chryler i.e. bail out Chrysler by paying the CEO of a private equity funds to sell to GM.

The real question is are we as a whole the nation willing to cut back and let the Government to further inject trillions into highway construction, education loan, rebuilding of the infrastructure, and American workers not ask for further pay raise.

Are we willing to learn from the German, "one person, one job" model to spread the wealth, work hard and build quality cars, and products, and spend less on non-essential products.

Should we change to part-time 6 hours job so more people have jobs instead of 8 hours job or four days work.

So far none of the candidates have any solution to save America so I hold back at the chance that Obama will succeed. But Obama will bring chance but is that chance can save America ?

 

[AFA]

On the one side as someone on top of all this for years.

You have a new candidate undercutting the stated goals of the pubs which have softened because of Obama's popularity, and actually changed to take the best of both and appear the same depending on the excitiment of the crowds at rallies. They are riding Obama's wave of approval.

Obama recently said, he thought suddenly McCain was stealing all his signs that said, "Change", because he didn't say that until a few weeks ago. Before that, it was a status quo, par for the course, keep the course mentality and he still exhibits that in his Iraq-victory rhetoric. He's from the Vietnam era. Does this make sense to anyone that actually reads recent history?

This isn't last weeks Soup de Jour, McCain has clearly changed his position to more mimic Obama popular policy from the start, and once your attention is had, goes elsewhere. McCain is a Vietnam vet. Everyone knows Vietnam was a bad investment for the wrong reasons as is Iraq. As a survivor, he must be out of his mind talking victory in Iraq for exactly the same wrong reasons the US was in Indochina! What happened to the get out of Iraq position? Didn't Rumsfeld talk about a 6 month war? Didn't Bush say the reason for the Iraq invasion was weapons of mass destruction before changing the story to highlight bringing freedom and democracy to people there that clearly didn't want a US invasion to lead to this fiasco? So where is McCain's plan to get out? It's non existant because he wants victory over an enemy that never existed there.

WTF! Isn't that more Halliburton, Lockheed, Blackwater and others corrupt involvement leading to a continued drain on US lives and costing $12M per month. WTF! is this guy's plan?

Most American's are too caught up in "Survivor" to know what wool is being pulled over their eyes in just the short term.

 

[Legzman]

Personally I don't like either candidate for president. Oh big fuckin deal we can chose our leader in this country. There are what close to if not more than a billion people in the U.S. and our choice for who runs the country are to douche bags? Seriously, there should be at least a few hundred choices.

Also, chew on this! Obama Joe Biden sounds an awful lot like Osama Bin Laden. Say it out loud!

 

[lovejoy]

Obama Joe Biden, Osama Bin Laden.!

 

[Friday on my mind]

Personally I don't like either candidate for president. Oh big fuckin deal we can chose our leader in this country. There are what close to if not more than a billion people in the U.S. and our choice for who runs the country are to douche bags? Seriously, there should be at least a few hundred choices.

Also, chew on this! Obama Joe Biden sounds an awful lot like Osama Bin Laden. Say it out loud!

FYI ,US population just recently crossed the 300 million mark.Just so you know .Was only 200 million in about 1960.

 

[lovejoy]

around 310 millions counting the illegal ! LOL !

 

[AFA]

Personally I don't like either candidate for president. Oh big fuckin deal we can chose our leader in this country. There are what close to if not more than a billion people in the U.S. and our choice for who runs the country are to douche bags? Seriously, there should be at least a few hundred choices.

Also, chew on this! Obama Joe Biden sounds an awful lot like Osama Bin Laden. Say it out loud!

My guess is you just tuned in a few weeks ago at most.

around 310 millions counting the illegal ! LOL !

The illegals are the lazy one's working 12 hour days and providing you with $1.50 a pound tomatoes and cheap housecleaning, while Joe the Plumber dreams about a 10 man work force under his control so he can make $250,000 a year. That's the way it usually works.

 

[Legzman]

My guess is you just tuned in a few weeks ago at most.

Nope, never cared to find one I like. I was just saying what his name sounds like is all!

 

[don_equis]

:bowdown: or :dunno:

 

[titsrock]

Here's an open question: why are so many "intellectual" and accomplished Republicans all of a sudden coming out and supporting Barack Obama?

I would like Toasted or Meester to answer this too.

 

[AFA]

Here's an open question: why are so many "intellectual" and accomplished Republicans all of a sudden coming out and supporting Barack Obama?

I would like Toasted or Meester to answer this too.

Good question. Also, why do people forget that the same group that brought you Iraq and 8 years of Bush are now bringing you John McCain and Palin. Doesn't that in itself show how ridiculous a wasted vote for change that is?

I'd stop eating at that restaurant after looking at the health reports and seeing the cockroach crap all over the place.