War, what is it good for?

[Supafly]

Ukraine will join NATO. Do you think they will ever accept any guarantees from Russia? No.

 

[Little Red Wagon Repairman]

Ukraine will join NATO.

We will agree to disagree on that one for sure with one of us eventually being proven right. Ukraine is in a weak negotiating position which becomes weaker by the day. Our stooge Tony Blinken is an empty suit and his boss spends most of his time kicking back in his sarcophagus.

 

[tvstrip]

So while announcement of a peace deal is great...

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c93ll522e9no

Israeli air strikes continued after the deal was announced on Wednesday. At least 12 people were killed in Gaza City, where a doctor told the BBC staff "did not rest for one minute" during the "bloody night".
Strikes were carried out on 50 targets in Gaza since the deal's announcement, the Israel Defense Forces and the Israeli Security Agency said in a statement.

Getting as many punches in as possible before the deal takes effect is not good faith.

And that's assuming it's even signed before Sunday.

 

[Supafly]

Gaza - thus, effectively: Hamas - is getting ~6.000 supporters / soldiers back, which means... Onward to prepare October, 6th 2.0.

And as there are rockets flying from Gaza into Israel, Israel would be foolish not to defend itself

 

[tvstrip]

Can we all agree that it would be nice if the ceasefire holds as planned?

 

[Mr. Daystar]

Can we all agree that it would be nice if the ceasefire holds as planned?

It would be great if it held. No one I know that is pro Israel, wants to see war continue.

 

[gmase]

Can we all agree that it would be nice if the ceasefire holds as planned?

Yes, it would very nice. How have the prior ceasefires held up?

The part which is difficult to comprehend is Hamas being cheered by locals. There is a ceasefire now, but their homes and lives were completely destroyed over the past year. The war displaced 90% of the residents and destroyed two-thirds of Gazan structures. Rebuilding will be a nightmare.

 

[tvstrip]

Yes, it would very nice. How have the prior ceasefires held up?

The part which is difficult to comprehend is Hamas being cheered by locals.

I could be wrong, but are they not cheering for Palestine, not Hamas? Or just the ceasefire in general? I didn't hear any "Alu Akbars", just general cheering.

There is a ceasefire now, but their homes and lives were completely destroyed over the past year. The war displaced 90% of the residents and destroyed two-thirds of Gazan structures. Rebuilding will be a nightmare.

Who exactly is footing the bill for that. Pottery Barn rules say "You Break it, you pay for it", but somehow I don't think isreal is getting their chequebooks out.

 

[gmase]

I could be wrong, but are they not cheering for Palestine, not Hamas? Or just the ceasefire in general? I didn't hear any "Alu Akbars", just general cheering.

I noted some articles specifically referenced “Alu Akbar,” but here is a Reuters one noting the cheering of the crowds.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...re-between-israel-hamas-kicks-off-2025-01-19/

Iran called it a victory for the resistance:
https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...re-between-israel-hamas-kicks-off-2025-01-19/

Who exactly is footing the bill for that. Pottery Barn rules say "You Break it, you pay for it", but somehow I don't think isreal is getting their chequebooks out.

I would think that Hamas’s supporters would be lining up to rebuild Gaza. Iran should be front and center for providing funding. By invading Israel, Hamas is the proximate cause of the destruction.

 

[tvstrip]

I would think that Hamas’s supporters would be lining up to rebuild Gaza. Iran should be front and center for providing funding. By invading Israel, Hamas is the proximate cause of the destruction.

If isreal was smart (LOL), they would be footing the bill and building up Gaza to 1st world standards. That is how you win over people after a war.
I might have said this before, but look at post-WWII Germany & Japan as great examples.

Bombing Gaza to the stone age ironically makes it ideal for rebuilding modern buildings. There's even the benefit of creating foundations and architecture that make subsequent illicit tunnel building difficult. It even gives isrealis an excuse to be in the area, which would make it harder for rebel groups to rebuild in that area.

All this is of course, hypothetical. Because isreal has no intent on funding the rebuilding efforts.

 

[Supafly]

Building up Gaza? Because how Gaza used those billions of help and chose to turn water pipes into rockets worked out so well for the Gazans and Tsrael?

As long as Hamas is the elected government in Gaza (... and making big steps of taking over Judäa and Samaria), a ceasefire will result in the ongoing abuse of the Gazans, further indoctrination of the children in Gaza to become Hamas soldiers and perpetuation of the jihad against Israel.

There have to be elections in Gaza, and the Gwzans have to show if they can elect peace. Of course, we know they won't.

So, in the end, Israel will have to keep on making sure the next Genocide by Gaza does not happen. Yes, by Gaza, as Hamas is Gaza.

 

[gmase]

All this is of course, hypothetical. Because isreal has no intent on funding the rebuilding efforts.

Rebuilding and rebombing would be quite awkward.

A Marshall Plan for Gaza would probably work as well as the US efforts at rebuilding Afghanistan. I do not see how this works out. Gaza will be one large refugee camp for a long time. The human toll will be overwhelming.

 

[tvstrip]

Rebuilding and rebombing would be quite awkward.

A Marshall Plan for Gaza would probably work as well as the US efforts at rebuilding Afghanistan. I do not see how this works out. Gaza will be one large refugee camp for a long time. The human toll will be overwhelming.

Which raises the question: Why do you think the US succeeded in rebuilding Japan/Germany (and to a degree, Iraq), while not so much in Afghanistan?

And on that note, Iraq is the closest to Gaza (at least, physically), and it's been relatively successful.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq#Government_and_politics

According to the 2023 V-Dem Democracy indices Iraq was the third most electoral democratic country in the Middle East.[78]

 

[Torre82]

Japan was bombed into adolescence. Afghanistan was already there.

 

[Supafly]

Extra financial efforts for the already overfinanced Gaza area? It has and gets all the aid it needs, what it needs to do now is get rid of the Hamas admin that leeches it almost all away. But noone except Israel is willing to do this, the UN, most of the countries financing it, and most of the Gaza citizens are okay with Hamas taking care of business.

 

[gmase]

Which raises the question: Why do you think the US succeeded in rebuilding Japan/Germany (and to a degree, Iraq), while not so much in Afghanistan?

The world was ready to be done fighting in the aftermath of WW2 while religious zealots are a difficult breed to convert.

And on that note, Iraq is the closest to Gaza (at least, physically), and it's been relatively successful.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq#Government_and_politics

Geographically it is closer, but Hamas is more similar to the Taliban than Hussein’s Ba’ath party. Religion seems to be a more difficult opponent than nationalism.

 

[gmase]

On another note, are we all enjoying the end of the Urkraine special military operation? Or did Trump not deliver on his promise to end it on Day one?

 

[tvstrip]

On another note, are we all enjoying the end of the Urkraine special military operation? Or did Trump not deliver on his promise to end it on Day one?

Didn't he extend that deadline to "year one" instead of "day one"? LOL

 

[gmase]

Didn't he extend that deadline to "year one" instead of "day one"? LOL

He was going to do it before taking office too.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...ukraine-peace-deal-is-months-away-2025-01-15/

Let's rename Gaza Trumpland and give it Israel. Trump wants to relocate the population and rebuild.
Trump: "Almost everything’s demolished and people are dying there, so I’d rather get involved with some of the Arab nations and build housing in a different location where I think they could maybe live in peace for a change”

https://thehill.com/policy/international/5107238-trump-gaza-strip-cnn/

 

[Supafly]

Trump administration floats plans to push Jordan and Egypt to accept

...

A suggestion by President Trump to “clean out” the Gaza Strip and ask Egypt and Jordan to take in more Palestinians raised new questions on Sunday about United States policy toward the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and two of its most important allies in the Middle East.
Mr. Trump’s comments appeared to echo the wishes of the Israeli far right that Palestinians be encouraged to leave Gaza — an idea that goes to the heart of Palestinian fears that they will be driven from their remaining homelands.
“You’re talking about probably a million and a half people, and we just clean out that whole thing,” Mr. Trump said of Gaza on Saturday. “I don’t know. Something has to happen, but it’s literally a demolition site right now.”
Mr. Trump told reporters on Air Force One that he had spoken to King Abdullah II of Jordan about the issue, saying, “I said to him, ‘I’d love for you to take on more because I’m looking at the whole Gaza Strip right now, and it’s a mess.’” He added that he would also like Egypt to take in more Palestinians and that he would speak to the country’s president, Abdel Fattah el-Sisi, about the issue.

He said that Palestinians could be in Jordan and Egypt “temporarily, or could be long-term.”
It was unclear from Mr. Trump’s comments if he was suggesting that all of the people in Gaza leave. The enclave has a population of about two million.
...

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/26/world/middleeast/trump-gaza-jordan-egypt.html

There you go! civillians move out, and shed the permanent refugee lifestyle that made them stay in their supportive road for Hamas, trade that for a permanent life as a self-supporting citizen in their new countries.

After that, the "Ben Gurion Canal Project" could bring peace to that end of the ongoing wars in the area.

https://www.eurasiareview.com/17112...l-revolutionary-alternative-to-suez-analysis/