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War, what is it good for?

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Meanwhile … the battle in the Ukraine keeps going on. The US shipped some longer-range missiles for the UKR to use. The Arsenal of Democracy is still in business.

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/...s-missiles-to-launch-surprise-strike-00121932

War is good business if you are a defense contractor.
It's good for a lot more than that. The heat treating facility I worked at, hardened a lot of steel, that is used BY the contractors, and so did the plating companies I dropped the stuff off to. It's fucked up, but war is good for business, unfortunately, they figured that out during WWII, when we were absolutely doing the right thing, for the right reason, and have exploited it, ever since. We really had no business being in Korea or Vietnam, and as far as the first gulf war, I have mixed feelings, the second one was all Cheney(haliburton) and Bush(a mindless patsy that obeyed Cheney) reaping profits from oil, and exploitation. The other problem is, we are clearly thinning ourselves out way to much, and other forces can see, and exploit that. What happens when we need those munitions to defend home soil. The thoughts of no one EVER being able to invade our country, are no longer realistic. China and Russia, do have some capability there. Especially Russia, being just a stones throw across the Bering Sea.
 

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Who knows, maybe she'll hold 'em off until back up arrives. Although I'm sure we have some kind of presence up there. I know we have an air base.
 
At least 500 dead from a hospital blast in Gaza. Both sides are pointing the finger at each other.
https://apnews.com/article/israel-p...-biden-rafah-e062825a375d9eb62e95509cab95b80c

https://apnews.com/article/israel-p...s-rescue-war-b4147d61a1fd1628e1029349224ab708
At dawn Monday, Israeli warplanes struck the headquarters of the Civil Defense in Gaza City, killing seven paramedics as they prepared for a rescue mission, the Interior Ministry said. In widely shared videos of the aftermath, medics, shellshocked and exhausted, crouched on the back of their blood-smeared ambulance with their heads in their hands.

“They targeted a center for ambulances,” one of them cried out, his voice frantic. “There are no weapons. There are no militants. There is nothing, nothing but civilians.”

The Israeli military didn’t immediately comment on the airstrike, but has alleged in the past that Hamas militants use hospitals and rescue services as protective cover. It says it only targets sites and infrastructure used by Hamas and other militant groups.
It doesn't help Israel's case that this isn't the first of medical personnel causalities, even in this conflict alone. The last part there in particular would indicate that they're fine with targeting medical facilities if it's used by Hamas.
 

gmase

Nattering Nabob of Negativism
Ever go in such a circle that you forget where you started? Hamas struck Israeli border towns, took (and still retain) civilian hostages, killed scores of civilians, and generally escalated (reignited?) the conflict. Israel responded.

Israel hit a Civil Defense facility. The Islamic Jihad may have blown up a hospital killing ~500 of its own. Hamas still has hostages.

Who is the good team here? I am still on the no-more-violence side.
 

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Ever go in such a circle that you forget where you started? Hamas struck Israeli border towns, took (and still retain) civilian hostages, killed scores of civilians, and generally escalated (reignited?) the conflict. Israel responded.

Israel hit a Civil Defense facility. The Islamic Jihad may have blown up a hospital killing ~500 of its own. Hamas still has hostages.

Who is the good team here? I am still on the no-more-violence side.
No one. Neither side wants cohabitation, they both want extermination. One side is full of religious zealots, the other a group that has dealt with attempts to exterminate them, both in WWII, and in their new homeland. I'm not condoning Israel's actions, but I think much of what they do is out of fear, that they still carry from decades ago. I also think they feel entitled to do as they please, because long ago they were handed a victim card, and someone forgot to put an expiration date on it. So, they both suck, and unfortunately it comes down to who is the lesser evil.
 

Luxman

#TRE45ON
What are the motivations of both sides in the Israel-Gaza conflict?

The Israel-Gaza conflict is a doozy. That's like trying to crack a 1000-piece jigsaw puzzle, except the pieces keep shifting and changing shape. But yeah, figuring out the motivations and agendas of all the players is key to understanding the conflict. On the Israeli side, you've got security concerns, historical claims to the land, and political pressure from different factions within the government. And on the Palestinian side, there are issues of displacement, human rights violations, and a feeling of disenfranchisement. It's like an intricate web of competing interests and motivations.

~ AI
 

Luxman

#TRE45ON

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/biden-prepares-oval-office-speech-162821849.html

Well this is special. Slow joe wants another 100 billion, for Israel, and Ukraine, but old people are still can't afford their meds, and children are going hungry, while veterans of our military, are sleeping under overpasses. I think all of the politicians need to donate THEIR money for a change. pelosi alone is worth over 100 million herself. It's time for them to put up, or shut up.
 
I also think they feel entitled to do as they please, because long ago they were handed a victim card, and someone forgot to put an expiration date on it.
I truly hate that. By that logic, the Japanese should have the right to nuke anyone they please. But instead, they banned any nuclear weapons on their soil. Even the US forces in Japan can't carry nukes. I'd say that is a better approach.
 

Luxman

#TRE45ON
That seems to be your thing these days. I wouldn't want to intrude.
I use AI because it can access, analyze, and make insightful conclusions about complex topics from vast amounts of data.
It's faster than using google search and I usually get a more complete and easier to understand answer to my searches.
.

In the context of war, Japan and Israel are completely different.
Japan committed many crimes against the people of neighboring countries, before they were stopped in 1945.
Most antisemitism and racism is baseless hatred passed on from previous generations.

~ Me
.

The historical and cultural contexts of Japan and Israel are quite distinct, especially when it comes to war. Here are some key differences:
Japan's involvement in WWII was driven by imperialist ambitions and aggressive militarism, whereas Israel has been involved in wars primarily out of self-defense.
Japan was a major power with an established military and economy, whereas Israel was a new state, formed in 1948, and faced significant military and economic challenges.
Japan's actions during WWII have been condemned as war crimes, whereas Israel's actions during wars have been highly controversial, with different perspectives on the justification and legality of their actions.

Antisemitism is often rooted in ignorance and stereotypes that have been perpetuated for centuries.
It's a form of prejudice and discrimination that has been around for a long time, and it's sad that it continues to be a problem today.

~ AI
 
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Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I truly hate that. By that logic, the Japanese should have the right to nuke anyone they please. But instead, they banned any nuclear weapons on their soil. Even the US forces in Japan can't carry nukes. I'd say that is a better approach.
Well that's my opinion, I don't know that it's really true. I assume, though I shouldn't. you don't like it because you feel the same? As far as Japan goes, we had no choice. The American people lost so many men fighting in the Pacific, not doing something that could have prevented the massive loss of life, by invading the mainland, would have caused an uproar.
 
Well that's my opinion, I don't know that it's really true. I assume, though I shouldn't. you don't like it because you feel the same? As far as Japan goes, we had no choice. The American people lost so many men fighting in the Pacific, not doing something that could have prevented the massive loss of life, by invading the mainland, would have caused an uproar.
I won't get into a discussion about whether the nukes should have been used in the way they were. That's a topic worthy of its own thread, and people much more knowledgeable than myself have debated it.

My comment was simply that if Israel feels justified in their actions per their "victim card", the Japanese have an equally valid card, but choose not to use it. And that their approach is preferable.

I equally hate lux's comment which essentially states that "Japan bad, they deserved to get nuked". No major power didn't do what Japan did. Heck, the US did in the Philippines what the Japanese did there, literally 25 years before.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine–American_War
Ditto to the people under British, French, Spanish, Portuguese and any other colonial power. But I don't hear anyone saying they "deserved" to be punished.

Anyways, semi-related:
‘A Japanese Schindler’: The remarkable diplomat who saved thousands of Jews during WWII
https://www.washingtonpost.com/history/2021/01/27/chiune-sugihara-jews-holocaust-japanese-schindler/

Over the next month, Sugihara wrote 2,000 more visas for any Jews who showed up at his office. He reportedly spent 20 hours a day that month writing as many visas as he could and was still writing them on the train platform when he was evacuated.
Today, descendants of those with Sugihara visas number between 40,000 and 100,000. One survivor dubbed him the “Japanese Schindler,” after Oskar Schindler, the German factory owner who saved 1,200 Jews.
When asked later why he did it, Sugihara said, “It is the kind of sentiments anyone would have when he actually sees refugees face to face, begging with tears in their eyes. He just cannot help but sympathize with them
 

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Yeah, I don't think we would find much common ground on a debate about WWII, and Japan, or Japan vs. Israel. I think before it goes further I'm gonna suggest "agree to disagree", and shift away from that one.
 

gmase

Nattering Nabob of Negativism
Time for a dmase interjection:
So let's leave it alone 'cause we can't see eye to eye
There ain't no good guy, there ain't no bad guy
There's only you and me and we just disagree​


Based on the information and circumstances on August 1, 1945, Truman was correct with his decision. Japan has benefited from US protection since the war ended. When it was cheaper for a builder in Pittsburgh to buy Japanese steel than steel from across the rive there was a problem. Plenty of people and towns paid that price.

Philosophical question: If AI fakes are banned, should AI posts be as well? I say 'no' if they're properly attributed.
 

Mr. Daystar

In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I think it's only ai fakes of celebrities, and probably kids and animal stuff. Personally, I think it's just an excuse to look at little girls.
 
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