Do you believe in God?
- Thread starter vsdsc
- Start date
FYI... what you just described is the Christian doctrine of Original Sin: everybody sins from birth because they're born in an antagonistic relationship to God. Nobody is born wanting to believe or capable of living sinlessly. Or, in your words, mankind is born without the capacity to truly believe in God. It's the central issue for all other Christian doctrines, and every denomination has its own particular way of reading the Bible to find a solution to it (including, as you mentioned, convincing themselves that they don't actually sin anymore).
Not everyone. Mary, the mother of Jesus, was born without Original Sin better known as the Immaculate Conception. The Holy Spirit can not go through fetal-hood in a sinful womb. And she did not sin in her entire life!! Just another wacky dogma trying to make Christian theology logically consistent. This is even nutter than the Holy Trinity. :yinyang:
ChefChiTown
The secret ingredient? MY BALLS
No...what I was saying is that nobody truly believes in God, because everybody sins (I'm not talking about your being born into an atagonistic, blah blah blah stuff that I don't understand
).Case in point...
Every single person who is a member of this forum, who visits this site and still claims that they believe in God, does not truly believe in God. Why, you ask? Because "LUST" is a sin, and coming to a pornography forum on the internet is the defintion of lust. If they truly believed in God, they wouldn't willingly sin and go against God's will.
No...what I was saying is that nobody truly believes in God, because everybody sins (I'm not talking about your being born into an atagonistic, blah blah blah stuff that I don't understand
Case in point...
Every single person who is a member of this forum, who visits this site and still claims that they believe in God, does not truly believe in God. Why, you ask? Because "LUST" is a sin, and coming to a pornography forum on the internet is the defintion of lust. If they truly believed in God, they wouldn't willingly sin and go against God's will.
There are a couple problems here:
1. Believing in God does not necessarily mean believing in a moral or personal God. There are plenty of people who believe God exists and that he doesn't give a shit what humans do or do not do.
2. Believing in God does not necessarily mean believing in Hell. Even if you believe in a moral God who has given morality to mankind, that doesn't mean that you believe he will eternally punish everyone who disobeys him. For example, there are 7.6 million Jehovah's Witnesses who believe that those who disobey God will be annihilated... painlessly snuffed out of existence. And there are plenty of essentially Gnostic Christians who believe that physical mortality is just a testing time, and that at death everyone is freed from the ability to sin and reunited with God.
Philbert
Banned
No...what I was saying is that nobody truly believes in God, because everybody sins (I'm not talking about your being born into an atagonistic, blah blah blah stuff that I don't understand
Case in point...
Every single person who is a member of this forum, who visits this site and still claims that they believe in God, does not truly believe in God. Why, you ask? Because "LUST" is a sin, and coming to a pornography forum on the internet is the defintion of lust. If they truly believed in God, they wouldn't willingly sin and go against God's will.
You don't speak for me, or many others on this site...you don't understand, per your own statement previous, so your pronouncement is as pointless as your post.
Case in point...lust isn't a sin, it's part of the machine. Acting on lust (rape, promescuity, etc.) is "sinful", as mankind is supposed to inhabit a higher plane of awareness on this planet, and has a moral code that can be followed by those who wish to. Choosing to sin doesn't make it disappear, but that's what the point is of morality...seeing why something is good/bad and choosing to do the good thing.
I try to teach my daughter the choice we face is not what we want to do in each situation we face, but to try to see what is the right thing to do and do that. If we are lucky, what is right and what we want are the same thing.
Choosing to do what pleases us in spite of knowing it isn't the right thing to do is a personal choice, and life is long enough to learn to do better in the future.
Whatever...discussing religion and politics is like a half-blind man trying to see a black bird in a dark room.
A sin is a violation of the law of God in thought, word, or deed and shows the sinfulness of the human heart. Lust is a sin even if it's only a thought. I inform you of this so you will not go to hell by believing thoughts are not sins. If you do go to hell I will see you there.
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
Of course not.
So.. Porn, porn.. :] Let's talk about way different from that
By the way, I believe :yesyes:
Lets see: Prayers unanswered, evil in the world, 6 million jew's cries go unanswered, no modern day miracles, the promise of everlasting fire for those that do not believe by a loving father.
Adam eating an apple when he was set up by an all knowing god.
AHHHHHHHHHH,,, this makes it hard to believe for me, yet there might be a god, but he hides himself fairly well.
Indeed. People and their creations are the only things on the planet. No one put us here for we are the products of the Mother Earth. :yinyang:
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
That's not what I was saying, YMIHERE. :spin:
ChefChiTown
The secret ingredient? MY BALLS
:looks over own posts again:
Nope, just as I thought. Not once did I say that I spoke for you or anyone else, so...:dunno:
Why is my post pointless? Oh, I get it...because I didn't 100% agree with your thoughts or your opinions? I'm not surprised. I mean, that's how religion works, right? Agree with me or you're wrong and you don't matter.
...I understand perfectly.
I don't know if you're religious, what religion you are or how serious you are about religion as a whole, but, according to the Bible, you're wrong. I'm not religous, but, in the Bible, Matthew 5:28-30 says...
The problem with a lot of religious people (not all) is that they contradict themselves on a constant basis when it comes to morality. The Bible, for example, lays out a specific set of rules and morals that people are supposed to follow. The people who believe in God and the Bible do two completely opposite things...
1) They claim that the Bible is the word of God; that the rules (Commandments) contained within the Bible should be followed if they want to get into Heaven, or else they will go to Hell
2) They claim that morals and values are an individual's choice
How can it be both God's way and an individual's way? :dunno:
With most people...yes. Some people refuse to accept the reality of the situation when it comes to religion and those are the people who are impossible to talk to. Some people get it, some people don't.
To each their own.
*Jumps in the discussion about Sins*
Sins definition varies from a religion to another. The Christian standpoint, as far as i know, is that a sin is a temptation acted out. Sorry for the following theological disgression (which i won't push too deep):
We aren't living in Heaven, neiter in Hell, so everything is grey around us. Temptations are induced in this world to challenge men' faith. To allow men to perform decisions based on their faith, to allow men' free-will to decide weither they will act wrongly or not. How would you perform your faith and your free-will if there was no temptations?
It's part of human nature to commit sins. We are even condamned to reproduce in a sinful way.
I think it was Saint-Augustine who was saying ( i quote out of memory) that a married man was doing a good thing but that a man choosing to renounce to reproduction was doing a better thing.
Yet, human can have faith, commit the flesh sin, within marriage, and still perfectly christian.
For christians, it is natural to live in a grey world, to be tempted and only a tempted christian can perform his faith by renoncing to the temptation. Or by accepting the sin, within a Saint-Augustine mindset considering what is wrong (evil) or right (good), then deciding what is good (allowing your soul to access Heaven at the end of your life) or better (allowing you to become a Saint).
Anyway...
Do i beleive in God?
No
Then why the fuck are you annoying us with this freaking theology stuff!
Well. It was part of my anthropological formation :o
Sins definition varies from a religion to another. The Christian standpoint, as far as i know, is that a sin is a temptation acted out. Sorry for the following theological disgression (which i won't push too deep):
We aren't living in Heaven, neiter in Hell, so everything is grey around us. Temptations are induced in this world to challenge men' faith. To allow men to perform decisions based on their faith, to allow men' free-will to decide weither they will act wrongly or not. How would you perform your faith and your free-will if there was no temptations?
It's part of human nature to commit sins. We are even condamned to reproduce in a sinful way.
I think it was Saint-Augustine who was saying ( i quote out of memory) that a married man was doing a good thing but that a man choosing to renounce to reproduction was doing a better thing.
Yet, human can have faith, commit the flesh sin, within marriage, and still perfectly christian.
For christians, it is natural to live in a grey world, to be tempted and only a tempted christian can perform his faith by renoncing to the temptation. Or by accepting the sin, within a Saint-Augustine mindset considering what is wrong (evil) or right (good), then deciding what is good (allowing your soul to access Heaven at the end of your life) or better (allowing you to become a Saint).
Anyway...
Do i beleive in God?
No
Then why the fuck are you annoying us with this freaking theology stuff!
Well. It was part of my anthropological formation :o
Wainkerr99
Closed Account
No.
I know there is God. There's a difference.
I know there is God. There's a difference.
A sin is a violation of the law of God in thought, word, or deed and shows the sinfulness of the human heart. Lust is a sin even if it's only a thought. I inform you of this so you will not go to hell by believing thoughts are not sins. If you do go to hell I will see you there.
Save a spot for me by the tv!
Wainkerr99
Closed Account
OK, look, I could go one for a while, but (this time) I won't. I have prayed for people. I remember one lady in particular. I really knuckled down. A couple of days later, while I slept in the afternoon, I 'saw' a person enter the room. he was bald, the dace I couldn't make out. Anyway, he started strangling me. This is not the first time this has happened. I struggled to wake up, willing myself to say "Jesus" out loud. After a minute or so he, it, left. And NO it wasn't a BREAK IN and NO I wasn't imagining it and NO it's not - the favourite of unbelieving folk - 'psychological.'
Many years back I 'saw' a group of demons, maybe 20. They were trying to enter me via my back as I slept. A being in white appeared saying, "Leave my child alone." They left His child alone, quicker than a wink.
Have I seen Jesus? Yes. Have I seen God, no, obviously, just Light. Angels? Wings and light, mostly. I have felt their comfort.
I prayed once for a chap in a store. His friend told me he was a confirmed atheist. Well, the room was swimming with a tangible presence. He looked at me with shock and I dunno what else.
Oops, looks like this is going to be long.
Why does God allow evil. Jee I can't believe people ask that. Let's make it real simple. Someone decides to film, let's say, extreme, girl bashing porn. Hmm. They USED to have a conscience. Now they really don't seem to care. Their conscience has been seared.
Someone may decide to shoot a cop. A small, still voice will urge him not to, but, he will ignore it. Maybe that cop just left church to go on duty. He leaves a beautiful wife and a newborn baby behind. God's fault? No. The shooter had a choice. God cannot counter your will. Otherwise you would be a programmed being.
Is there a devil? Well, people worship him, don't they? Do they follow him? Yes. Do they still have a choice? Yes.
God allows you a choice. Like they said in "Charmed" even, that episode with Krista Allen where she speaks to the Source - "The great flaw in the plan."
It isn't really a flaw. It's just that everyone chooses evil over good, usually.
If God overrode the shooter's, rapist's, etc, will, he would not be God. He would be Dominus Immortalis. Maybe then everyone would follow Him. You would not have a choice. However, then Lucifer would go screeching into Heaven - yes, he does still have access there - querying why God can stop people doing stuff and making Himself so well known, when he can't. No fair!!!
Also, creativity might be severely limited.
I don't know why Man has to choose. Maybe because there was some or other fruit incident in a garden 10 000 years ago. (Not an apple, it doesn't say anywhere it was an apple). Oh and by the way - it isn't money is the root of all evil, it is "the love of money is the root of all evil."
God does not come bludgeoning Himself into our consciousness, otherwise Satan could do the same, which means our choice would be clear. here would be no more need for faith or believing or discovering, or a childlike discovery of truth and the wonder when we find it.
Evidence. Well, the bible does say the evidence is clear but people choose to disregard it, deliberately hardening their hearts against truth. Think of this if you would: we are the 3rd rock from the sun: God is 3 Persons.
We are protected still by some ozone. God protects us.
Our planet is shielded by Jupiter. God is our shield. Do you honestly think it is
sheer blind accidental luck that there is a giant planet deflecting meteors?
Yes, terrible things are done in the name of religion. Not God sitting up there rubbing His hands in cruel glee. Christians were persecuted even for saying the earth is round - when the bible says: "He is seated above the circle of the earth." I posted elsewhere God tells people even though they make their home amongst the stars, yet there He will find them.
I myself have prayed for people to get well. They got well. Do I have a super duper powerful mind? If I did I wouldn't be here right now, I'd be rich and famous already! I like to think. Point is, no, I'm the dude everyone ignores, you know, blonde hair, don't smoke, looks like, well anyway I'm not tall dark and handsome.
People try to ignore or curse God or push Him away 'cos they think He is out to spoil their fun. He isn't, He wants to deliver. I still think it's OK to enjoy a nice sexy babe. Hopefully I will be allowed to do that for a while still. (Lol).
God has helped me time and time again in my personal life. Crutch, I hear you sneer. Well, if it is, so be it. What a wonderful crutch. Kudos to you what can do it all by yourself. Many can, and do. I battle with computer code and the latest term for everything. What is the one I heard recently? Hapsic or some such thing, to do with Samsung's iPod killer. I don't know. It's neverfreakingending. Endless terminology and everyone knows 'cept me.
Still, God loves me. When I have gone to a very dear friend in the past - at the end of all my bewilderment and arguments, I just felt His love shining through......
:lovecoupl
Many years back I 'saw' a group of demons, maybe 20. They were trying to enter me via my back as I slept. A being in white appeared saying, "Leave my child alone." They left His child alone, quicker than a wink.
Have I seen Jesus? Yes. Have I seen God, no, obviously, just Light. Angels? Wings and light, mostly. I have felt their comfort.
I prayed once for a chap in a store. His friend told me he was a confirmed atheist. Well, the room was swimming with a tangible presence. He looked at me with shock and I dunno what else.
Oops, looks like this is going to be long.
Why does God allow evil. Jee I can't believe people ask that. Let's make it real simple. Someone decides to film, let's say, extreme, girl bashing porn. Hmm. They USED to have a conscience. Now they really don't seem to care. Their conscience has been seared.
Someone may decide to shoot a cop. A small, still voice will urge him not to, but, he will ignore it. Maybe that cop just left church to go on duty. He leaves a beautiful wife and a newborn baby behind. God's fault? No. The shooter had a choice. God cannot counter your will. Otherwise you would be a programmed being.
Is there a devil? Well, people worship him, don't they? Do they follow him? Yes. Do they still have a choice? Yes.
God allows you a choice. Like they said in "Charmed" even, that episode with Krista Allen where she speaks to the Source - "The great flaw in the plan."
It isn't really a flaw. It's just that everyone chooses evil over good, usually.
If God overrode the shooter's, rapist's, etc, will, he would not be God. He would be Dominus Immortalis. Maybe then everyone would follow Him. You would not have a choice. However, then Lucifer would go screeching into Heaven - yes, he does still have access there - querying why God can stop people doing stuff and making Himself so well known, when he can't. No fair!!!
Also, creativity might be severely limited.
I don't know why Man has to choose. Maybe because there was some or other fruit incident in a garden 10 000 years ago. (Not an apple, it doesn't say anywhere it was an apple). Oh and by the way - it isn't money is the root of all evil, it is "the love of money is the root of all evil."
God does not come bludgeoning Himself into our consciousness, otherwise Satan could do the same, which means our choice would be clear. here would be no more need for faith or believing or discovering, or a childlike discovery of truth and the wonder when we find it.
Evidence. Well, the bible does say the evidence is clear but people choose to disregard it, deliberately hardening their hearts against truth. Think of this if you would: we are the 3rd rock from the sun: God is 3 Persons.
We are protected still by some ozone. God protects us.
Our planet is shielded by Jupiter. God is our shield. Do you honestly think it is
sheer blind accidental luck that there is a giant planet deflecting meteors?
Yes, terrible things are done in the name of religion. Not God sitting up there rubbing His hands in cruel glee. Christians were persecuted even for saying the earth is round - when the bible says: "He is seated above the circle of the earth." I posted elsewhere God tells people even though they make their home amongst the stars, yet there He will find them.
I myself have prayed for people to get well. They got well. Do I have a super duper powerful mind? If I did I wouldn't be here right now, I'd be rich and famous already! I like to think. Point is, no, I'm the dude everyone ignores, you know, blonde hair, don't smoke, looks like, well anyway I'm not tall dark and handsome.
People try to ignore or curse God or push Him away 'cos they think He is out to spoil their fun. He isn't, He wants to deliver. I still think it's OK to enjoy a nice sexy babe. Hopefully I will be allowed to do that for a while still. (Lol).
God has helped me time and time again in my personal life. Crutch, I hear you sneer. Well, if it is, so be it. What a wonderful crutch. Kudos to you what can do it all by yourself. Many can, and do. I battle with computer code and the latest term for everything. What is the one I heard recently? Hapsic or some such thing, to do with Samsung's iPod killer. I don't know. It's neverfreakingending. Endless terminology and everyone knows 'cept me.
Still, God loves me. When I have gone to a very dear friend in the past - at the end of all my bewilderment and arguments, I just felt His love shining through......
:lovecoupl
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