I rest my case.
Should there just be a "Mass shooting in the US" sticky thread?
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Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I stand by what I said. How can anyone think it's unreasonable to eliminate crime, and criminals, that do not follow the laws, before imposing more laws, on the law abiding, I know things need to change, but it needs to change for some segments of society, BEFORE the already over burdened, are burdened further. And I'm not talking about firearms specifically with that comment. This country has far more then a gun problem, and that needs to be fixed too, and in some cases FIRST. If your car is running like shit, you don't yank the motor and replace it, BEFORE you try to fix it.
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
Beto in 2019:
“Do I care more about how upset somebody is who owns a weapon of war that they don’t need for hunting or self-defense, or do I care more about the families who’ve lost a child?”
https://denver.cbslocal.com/2019/09...orado-buyback-ar-15-ak-47-semi-automatic/?amp
“Do I care more about how upset somebody is who owns a weapon of war that they don’t need for hunting or self-defense, or do I care more about the families who’ve lost a child?”
https://denver.cbslocal.com/2019/09...orado-buyback-ar-15-ak-47-semi-automatic/?amp
Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I'll guarantee you one thing, you care more then the politicians that want gun control. In fact, if you think ANY of the elected knucleheads that sponge off of our tax dollars truly gives even the slightest fuck about an innocent child's life, your sadly mistaken. Because they don't. They care about nothing more, then themselves, their money, and their power. So yeah, you care, but they don't, they just want more power, and more control.
And if they pass laws, or just plain change the law by executive order, what about the millions of guns out there? Do you think people will really turn them in?, Do you think they'll be able to go to every house and just kick in a door and take it away? What happens when they have what they want, and it still happens, because it will?
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
They will need to be controlled and regulated. Obtaining them would require a special license obtained by training and education.
It has to be law and not an EO. Otherwise, the next occupant with a different viewpoint would rescind it. We should not be a government by fiat.
Control would occur at the point of sale rather than confiscation.
Not at all.
Nope. I can’t imagine the carnage from that process. A new Waco every hour. In fact, I doubt many law enforcement officers would participate.
The grip then becomes tighter. Much like the BAC limits for drunk driving have been gradually lowered. We started with none, went to 0.10%, and now 0.08%. And, yes, we still have drunk drivers and repeat offenders still get behind the wheel. The problem has improved over the years, but it still happens. We keep adjusting the laws.
I'm guessing that whole "good guy with a gun" stuff didn't work out so well in this case, as even the damn police couldn't be bothered to stop the shooter.
Ah, the good old right-wing fantasy of the government agents going from door to door to take away people's guns. And that's when the good old gun owner replies "over my dead body". So the government guys try to get in and take the guns but the guy kills them...
Because, in the mind of a gun-enthusiast, government agents are just as dumb as the burglars from Home Alone.
Anyways...
The thing is, even if some gun control laws are passed, no confiscation will happen because any government would know it would end very badly. But, in quite many mass shootings, the shooter used guns he had bought especially for that so passing laws to prevent nutjobs from getting guns would eliminate that possibility from them, it would make it more difficult for them to get guns. Yes, he could get guns on the black market but 1) it would cost him much more than the prince of a legal gun and 2) the black market is not a store you can push the front door and get in, you need a connection, you need to know a guy who knows a guy
Requiring a gun licence for any gun purchase would make it much harder for people with mental health issues or a criminal record or a domestics abusing history, people on the CIA's watch-list or (even illegal immigrants to get guns), etc.
You could also require applicants for a gun licence to go through some basic gun-safety training, including firing some shot (Having myself shot a few rounds I've been quite surprised by the recoil)
And, to law-abiding citizen it would only make it longer. And, given that it would take longer than 30 minutes, it would give people the occasion to think about what they are doing. And God knows taking some time to think before doing something is never a bad thing
Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I have no problem with mandatory training, I encourage it. I have no problem with cops going to get a guy with a red flag alert, but if you are going to take his guns, what if he turns out to just be a loud mouth, does he get them back, or if he really shouldn't have them, should he just lose that money, or should his family be allowed to sell them? I know the government isn't going to come for my guns, and thankfully, they're just afraid enough to know what the masses will do. They should fear us, but there are enough guns out there to be had, and it's as costly as you think, and it's not hard to know a guy. most people have a friend of a friend, some have family in the criminal world. Which also brings us to them. Before you fuck with anybody, those low life animals need to be eradicated, no more plea bargains. You commit a crime with a gun, prison FOR EVER. You die in a prison. If you think the gangs and other organized crime syndicates won't jump on guns, like they did drugs, you're foolish, because they will. The only way to stop those guns, is lock down the boarders, and ports. That BETTER get done, because I'm fucking tired of hearing about the human trash, that are gangs and cartels. Drag them out to the desert, and shoot them in the back of the head....the buzzards need to eat too.
Or in other words, if you think it's acceptable to impose stricter laws, on the people, then the people expect the law makers to crack down REAL FUCKING HARD, on the filth, dirtying up our streets.
Or in other words, if you think it's acceptable to impose stricter laws, on the people, then the people expect the law makers to crack down REAL FUCKING HARD, on the filth, dirtying up our streets.
Theopolis Q. Hossenffer
I am in America, not of it.
Take your stupid incel shit somewhere else you tedious sock wanker.
Yes.
Althought I wouldn't mind having to go through mandatory training again. Or maybe having some kind of "yellow flag".
Citizens shouldn't fear the government nor government should fear the citizens. They should trust each other. Or, at least, not live in a state of "cold war".
When government and citizens fear each other, it ends up Jan 6th like : citizens thinking they need to attack their government not to have their democracy rights supressed, senators rushed out of government building as the crowd chants "Hang the VP"
Most of those who commit those kind of mass shooting like we saw in Buffalo or in Texas are pretty lonely guys with very little friends, not the kind of people who havec the connections you speak of
Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Yes, the government SHOULD fear the people, as far as I'm concerned when you take that oath of office, you are an employee, and your silly square ass is now OWNED by the country. They should fear what power we truly have over them, and act accordingly, or in other words, know their place, and be good little bitches. I have no trust for any of them, and I haven't heard of a SINGLE fucking one, that cared about anything, or anybody but themselves, they're filth, every last one, is filth.
I'm not talking about mass shooters, they are an anomaly, and will never go away, no matter what laws you pass. I'm talking about the rest of the criminal world. If you add up all of the gang related murders in the U.S., I would bank on the odds the body count is higher then the mass shootings combined' I would also like to see every school have at least one police officer on campus, obviously a per student ratio, to be determined, and I would also like to see only one way in, and metal detectors at the doors. Obviously the doors would open out for emergency situations. Most of this crap happens in gun free zones, although I don't know if Texas has those, outside of federal buildings.
But I still stand by my statement, if ANY new laws are imposed on the law abiding, they better put their asses into gear and put a massive dent in the criminal goings on in this country, and control the Southern border completely, better yet, shut it down. Mexico has proven their contempt and disloyalty time and time again, by placing total blame on us for THEIR own doings. The president just made the United States DEA service remove a small plane from an airport, that was vital in secret operations against the cartels. The president seemed to think that treating cartel members with respect was mandatory, because they are people too. Problem is, THEY AREN'T. They're vile animals, ands need exterminating. Instead of sending all of those tanks to Ukraine, we should line them up on the border, guns pointed SOUTH. Instead of the wall, dig a giant trench, and fill it with sharks, gators, piranha, and regularly bloody up the water. Then a pile of dirt from the trench, booby trapped of course, then a mine field. If they make it through that, they should be met by snipers, and other assorted killing machines. As far as Canada goes, I would trust them to help us secure the North. They better start stepping up port inspections too, I would bet ships coming from China, the Middle East, and South America are all possible enemies of a lawful society, and corupt enough to try and slide in a container of guns. You can fit a lot of guns in just a 20' container.
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
Why do you keep focusing on the border during discussions about mass shootings? These incidents are perpetrated by home grown citizens. This is a uniquely American problem and tying this to border issues is just deflecting.
As for trying to equate mass shootings with gang shootings: yes the body count with gang violence is higher. The primary difference is acceptance of the risk. No kid going to school or parent sending their kids to schools is accepting or expecting this to happen. If you’re in a gang, you certainly accept and expect the consequences of the life choice.
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Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
Because there is a lot of violence regarding gangs and cartels, and they come from the southern border. I think if you want to eliminate that, which I feel is the least we should expect from our government. I also have heard a great deal of comments blaming America, for sending guns to mexico, so I think it should be locked down, so we aren't held responsible. But you are right, a better place would be the gun control thread, however I feel it's all intertwined. I also am aware the guns are usually bought legally. But if gun rights are going to be changed, then other things need to change too, and they need to change in concert with the laws, law abiding citizens will now have to follow. It is also not an exclusive thing to America. mexico has it happen all the time, just not schools, and usually by gangs and cartels, I don't want those people here, do you?
My point in comparing was that, when you add up all of the innocent victims of gang shootings, it's probably a higher number, but no one seems concerned about that, especially when politicians are trying to give them the right to vote. The worst part is, after all of these school shootings, no one ever seemed to be able to see all of the signs of the next one coming, to try and stop it, and no one ever seemed to tink it was fair to make anybody entering a school to be checked like they do when you go to an airport. Or to install metal detectors, or make it impossible to get in, by only one main entrance. I think we know they have the tech, and means to secure a school, but make it easy to evacuate if it comes down to the need. NOTHING ever gets tried, or tested, just, we have to stop it, that inert, inanimate object is to blame, and everyone that owns one is a nut, that needs to be look at, like he's a freak of nature. Not that some aren't.
Short answer, because I feel ALL OF IT, ties in together, and needs to be fixed together, so lawful people can feel safe anywhere they go. I also want to point out, in more then one post I mentioned the Northern border, and all ports. I also have pointed out M.C.'s, and ALL gangs, domestic and foreign.
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
I understand it is easy to always blame someone else, but most murders in the US are committed by and upon naturally born citizens using guns made in the U.S and purchased legally. (This ignores the fact that self-murder accounts for over half of gun deaths.)
Scapegoating immigrants is neither helpful nor useful.
Scapegoating immigrants is neither helpful nor useful.
Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I'm not using anybody for a scapegoat, I'm just blaming EVERYBODY. As I said, plenty of white and black trash, I'm not giving immigrants a pass, if they happen to be guilty too. I seriously doubt most criminals are using guns they bought under their real name. I would need to see proof of that. I also said I want the citizens that ruin it for everyone dealt with harshly also. You seem to wanna paint me a racist, as opposed to someone whose tired of seeing people get to lenient of a punishment, usually leading to further crime. AGAIN! ALL trash, don't care who, don't care gender, don't care color. If you abuse the 2nd Amendment, and or the lawful people of this country you ruin it for the good people, you should pay, with everything you can pay with, including your life. In fact, I'm all for letting a parent of a murdered child or spouse who's lost someone, flip the switch when it comes time for payment. In fact, they should get to choose the method of execution, within a set parameter of choices.
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
To be clear, I am not trying to paint you as a racist. Please point to my use of the term. Just trying to make it clear that homegrown talent is causing this havoc. Inserting immigration is a red herring.
We both know you like guns. In my worldview they are a cause of problems. Your view is winning. Be happy!
Mr. Daystar
In a bell tower, watching you through cross hairs.
I apologize if I wrongly accused you. My team isn't winning. My team wants to keep their rights, and remove them from criminals. I'll be honest, I don't even own a rifle, I am right handed, and left eye dominant, and it's really hard to make that work, and I'm to lazy to relearn every thing left handed. I own a shotgun, but you don't aim a shotgun, you point it.
I didn't read this article, but it seems like it might have to do with getting around red flag statements.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/young-gunmen-turn-toward-social-201034987.html
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