Wha-?
Since when is having an affair a Republican thing?
I mean, affairs go way back to say....
JFK?
At least?
H
Sad day for me...John Edwards is a sham--Affair?
- Thread starter titsrock
- Start date
Wha-?
Since when is having an affair a Republican thing?
I mean, affairs go way back to say....
JFK?
At least?
H
Facetious
Moderated
^ ^ Is this PD ? I wish you would join us on more of these discussions ! :hatsoff:
I agree with you regarding the tendencies of the greater media, they do tend to hype up a lot of sensationalist BS, regardless, it would be nice if our society could maybe at least salvage the institution of marriage. We've gone flaky on about every other tradition, principle and or virtue.
Even Edwards himself said something to the effect of becoming invincible (with all that power)
I agree with you regarding the tendencies of the greater media, they do tend to hype up a lot of sensationalist BS, regardless, it would be nice if our society could maybe at least salvage the institution of marriage. We've gone flaky on about every other tradition, principle and or virtue.
Let not the media be our prime example of integrity, yet they must continue to report.
Even Edwards himself said something to the effect of becoming invincible (with all that power)
Titsrock - You have every right to expect more from your leaders.
Let's see what you have encountered so far...
____________________________________
Objection type #1:
It's just his personal life.
It's not a big deal. It's just sex, who cares?
Concentrate on what matters - the issues.
____________________________________
It is not about "just sex". It's about...
1) The fact that he lied to and cheated on his own wife who was dying. (small character flaw? no big deal?)
2) He lied to the people he represents over and over again and only stopped when he got caught red handed (small character flaw? no big deal?)
He has said that he felt like he could "get away with anything" and..
If he is willing to lie to his dying wife - what do you think he won't lie about to you? Money laundering? Bad intelligence? Corruption?
Should we give him the chance to lie to us?
____________________________________
Objection type #2:
But other presidents have done the same or worse. And they lied, we just didn't know it before electing them.
____________________________________
That's true. But what is this supposed to justify? If you accidentally bought a car with bad brakes (and didn't know it) and then crashed --- would you use that crash as an example to justify buying a car that you know has bad brakes?? After all, other cars have done the same or worse.
No, you try to buy the best car you can. The fact that you have bought crappier cars (or selected crappier politicians) in the past is no justification for selecting a car you know is crap (or a politician you know is deceitful).
____________________________________
Objection type #3:
Many Americans cheat on their wives,therefore it's a double standard.
____________________________________
Many Americans can't find the U.S. on a world map. Many Americans rank Elvis as one of the top five Americans of all time. Many Americans think the world is less than 3000 years old. The list goes on.
He isn't running for the position of "any American." How low should we drop our standards? Even if we were willing to accept an elected "average joe" that cheats on his dying wife -- that is not who HE has claimed to be. He knew how high the pedestal was before he climbed on top of it. It is irrelevant who built the pedestal, the politicians, the people, or the media.
____________________________________
Objection type #4:
You are so naive, of course all politicians aren't honest
____________________________________
Again, if we believe this is true - what is the recommendation? Accept all dishonesty unless they have led us to war or worse? But they haven't had the chance. Until politicians are elected we have to go on other indicators regarding whether or not they would lie to us. That's why these other types of betrayal matter.
I wonder if some people ever questioned themselves when they were happy to criticize McCain for simply cussing at his wife (and not lying about it). Probably not. Instead, with merriment they rallied around the idea that it says something significant about his character. Yet these same people are willing to say that Edwards cheating on his dying wife and continually deceiving her and the public about it (as he paints himself as an "Honest Abe" champion of the people) is no big deal and we should just forget about it.
The point is not to defend anything that Bush, McCain, Nixon, or anyone else has done...simply to make the point that perhaps Edwards apologists aren't applying the same standard to Edwards that they do to other politicians?
Perhaps convincing such people of their hypocrisy will be as difficult / hopeless as convincing some conservatives that global warming is not a left wing conspiracy.
Let's see what you have encountered so far...
____________________________________
Objection type #1:
It's just his personal life.
It's not a big deal. It's just sex, who cares?
Concentrate on what matters - the issues.
____________________________________
It is not about "just sex". It's about...
1) The fact that he lied to and cheated on his own wife who was dying. (small character flaw? no big deal?)
2) He lied to the people he represents over and over again and only stopped when he got caught red handed (small character flaw? no big deal?)
He has said that he felt like he could "get away with anything" and..
If he is willing to lie to his dying wife - what do you think he won't lie about to you? Money laundering? Bad intelligence? Corruption?
Should we give him the chance to lie to us?
____________________________________
Objection type #2:
But other presidents have done the same or worse. And they lied, we just didn't know it before electing them.
____________________________________
That's true. But what is this supposed to justify? If you accidentally bought a car with bad brakes (and didn't know it) and then crashed --- would you use that crash as an example to justify buying a car that you know has bad brakes?? After all, other cars have done the same or worse.
No, you try to buy the best car you can. The fact that you have bought crappier cars (or selected crappier politicians) in the past is no justification for selecting a car you know is crap (or a politician you know is deceitful).
____________________________________
Objection type #3:
Many Americans cheat on their wives,therefore it's a double standard.
____________________________________
Many Americans can't find the U.S. on a world map. Many Americans rank Elvis as one of the top five Americans of all time. Many Americans think the world is less than 3000 years old. The list goes on.
He isn't running for the position of "any American." How low should we drop our standards? Even if we were willing to accept an elected "average joe" that cheats on his dying wife -- that is not who HE has claimed to be. He knew how high the pedestal was before he climbed on top of it. It is irrelevant who built the pedestal, the politicians, the people, or the media.
____________________________________
Objection type #4:
You are so naive, of course all politicians aren't honest
____________________________________
Again, if we believe this is true - what is the recommendation? Accept all dishonesty unless they have led us to war or worse? But they haven't had the chance. Until politicians are elected we have to go on other indicators regarding whether or not they would lie to us. That's why these other types of betrayal matter.
I wonder if some people ever questioned themselves when they were happy to criticize McCain for simply cussing at his wife (and not lying about it). Probably not. Instead, with merriment they rallied around the idea that it says something significant about his character. Yet these same people are willing to say that Edwards cheating on his dying wife and continually deceiving her and the public about it (as he paints himself as an "Honest Abe" champion of the people) is no big deal and we should just forget about it.
The point is not to defend anything that Bush, McCain, Nixon, or anyone else has done...simply to make the point that perhaps Edwards apologists aren't applying the same standard to Edwards that they do to other politicians?
Perhaps convincing such people of their hypocrisy will be as difficult / hopeless as convincing some conservatives that global warming is not a left wing conspiracy.
om3ga
It's good to be the king...
Politicians are human - the same as the rest of us...with flaws.
The best comment I've seen thus far (which sums up my opinion) is that the main mistake people make when they select a politician for office is believing said politician is morally better then us. Guess what? They aren't.
So John Edwards lied. He's not the first politician to lie about an affair, and he won't be the last. Just line him up alongside Bill Clinton, John Major, JFK, John McCain, and John "Two Jags" Prescott (or should that be "Two Shags"....
).However - if a politician's affair extends beyond personal private behavior and compromises his/her work as a public servant, then it becomes a matter of concern....
My :2 cents:
(and apologies for droning on.....:o)
The difference ...
I never really got upset with Clinton over Monica. Yes, it looked pathetic that he had sex with a subordinate. I still remember all those comments about male abusing their position of power against women from him, and all those cheers. But he remained humbled once he admitted to it. It really wasn't until the President of the National Organization of Women (NOW) came out and tried to excuse it that I, let alone my wife, took issue with it.
As I did "defend" Edwards, among other politicians, it's not like they were prosecuting others, and then ended up being involved with a criminal prostitution ring, looking like total hypocrites. I wish people would differentiate between people who merely had an affair and those who have built their entire career on it.
And no, they aren't just Republicans, but a number of Democrats -- including that very publicized one from New York.
The difference is that many politicians enact laws and state ethics they themselves don't live up to. And even worse yet, someone else tries to excuse it for them.
I never really got upset with Clinton over Monica. Yes, it looked pathetic that he had sex with a subordinate. I still remember all those comments about male abusing their position of power against women from him, and all those cheers. But he remained humbled once he admitted to it. It really wasn't until the President of the National Organization of Women (NOW) came out and tried to excuse it that I, let alone my wife, took issue with it.
But some politicians do try to pass laws or instill ethics against what they themselves do.
As I did "defend" Edwards, among other politicians, it's not like they were prosecuting others, and then ended up being involved with a criminal prostitution ring, looking like total hypocrites. I wish people would differentiate between people who merely had an affair and those who have built their entire career on it.
And no, they aren't just Republicans, but a number of Democrats -- including that very publicized one from New York.
No, at least he still had sex with a female adult. :1orglaugh
om3ga
It's good to be the king...
Re: The difference ...
And even more so the republican congressman from Florida (Mark something) who was on committees pushing laws against what he himself was accused of which was hitting on congressional pages(young people).As was said and evidenced by Spitzer hypocracy is not just a one party thing.But the pubs have been the ones who have tried to portray themselves as the party of "family values" and puritanical sexual morality MUCH more so than the dems.If they did not do that I would say leave them and their sexual doings alone as well.But it is the hypocracy that is the problem and why they are subject to being ridiculed more than most when exposed.
On John Edwards my biggest problem with all this is the wimpy way he has handled it.He should have just told everyone "screw off" this is none of your buisness and is a personal matter between me and my wife.Even though I liked what Edwards was saying when he was running for nomination I always felt he was too soft and not enough of a fighter.He showed the same thing in 2004 when he debated Cheney.He let Cheney who he tried to challenge on how Cheney could be a republican who are anti gay rights could reconcile his daughter being openly gay turn that on Edwards as being an inapproriate topic and was really wimpy in responding to Cheney.He should have pushed it and said c'mon Dick which is it,your daughter is wrong or your party is wrong? See ya John, you are now done not because you had sex liason but because you are a wimp.
And even more so the republican congressman from Florida (Mark something) who was on committees pushing laws against what he himself was accused of which was hitting on congressional pages(young people).As was said and evidenced by Spitzer hypocracy is not just a one party thing.But the pubs have been the ones who have tried to portray themselves as the party of "family values" and puritanical sexual morality MUCH more so than the dems.If they did not do that I would say leave them and their sexual doings alone as well.But it is the hypocracy that is the problem and why they are subject to being ridiculed more than most when exposed.
On John Edwards my biggest problem with all this is the wimpy way he has handled it.He should have just told everyone "screw off" this is none of your buisness and is a personal matter between me and my wife.Even though I liked what Edwards was saying when he was running for nomination I always felt he was too soft and not enough of a fighter.He showed the same thing in 2004 when he debated Cheney.He let Cheney who he tried to challenge on how Cheney could be a republican who are anti gay rights could reconcile his daughter being openly gay turn that on Edwards as being an inapproriate topic and was really wimpy in responding to Cheney.He should have pushed it and said c'mon Dick which is it,your daughter is wrong or your party is wrong? See ya John, you are now done not because you had sex liason but because you are a wimp.
I love his hypocracy in relation with all this rhetoric he rambled on about with his faith: http://pewforum.org/religion08/profile.php?CandidateID=6 More than anything, I think that is the kicker here.
It appears that "someone" within "Team Douchebag" paid off some clown to pose as the father of Baby Edwards. Johnny has "promised us" he will get to the bottom of who supplied the payoff
Yeah, sure Johnny. Go away and do that. Maybe you can hook up with OJ and find the real killers of Nicole Simpson and Ron Goldman while you're at it. Knock 2 birds with one stone...
Yeah, sure Johnny. Go away and do that. Maybe you can hook up with OJ and find the real killers of Nicole Simpson and Ron Goldman while you're at it. Knock 2 birds with one stone...
The mere act of running for President shows a lack of character. The idea revolves around saying what people want to hear, keeping your finger on the pulse of public opinion, and shifting your ideals as popular perception demands it.
Running for president is a sales job that requires an enormous ego to even want to undertake, and has little to do with character.
Not picking on your post at all Bodie, it was just a random pick out of the myriad posts commenting on Edwards' "character", as though he had any to begin with.
^Even if you're correct...I didn't read anything about lying, deception, adultery and fathering children out of wedlock....
The point that got me bent out of shape is that this Jackass has had his share of personal, familial tragedies (the death of his son, the diagnosis of his wife's cancer)...to sort of "ground him" either spiritually or emotionally...I thought he really had an honest call for public service.
The point that got me bent out of shape is that this Jackass has had his share of personal, familial tragedies (the death of his son, the diagnosis of his wife's cancer)...to sort of "ground him" either spiritually or emotionally...I thought he really had an honest call for public service.
Politicians love to get their dicks wet, its the power of knowing that your power can get any old woman you want, if I was in his shoes Id be doing the same thing, I would be a little more careful about it because who needs this kind of attention.
By the way who is John Edwards? Isnt he the telepathy guy, he speaks to the dead and all that crap :dunno:
By the way who is John Edwards? Isnt he the telepathy guy, he speaks to the dead and all that crap :dunno:
Same names different guys.Edwards is former US senator and was on the the ticket with Kerry as VP in 2004.He then ran this time for democrate nomination but lost.
To my friend Titsrock in a prvious post you mentioned poeple like FDR and JFK as being I guess in your mind respectable and would not do such things.I have already talked about JFK who was infamous for his affairs but FDR as well had a mistress.In fact she was with him when he died.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucy_Page_Mercer_Rutherfurd
Sorry to shatter your illusions lol.
No offense, but the only issue I have with this is...
That woman is ugly.
That woman is ugly.
That one about FDR certainly is a shock. I didn't know that. So the great presidents are the philandering bastards and the shitty presidents (Reagan, Hoover, H.W. Bush, Carter, Dubya) are the loyal ones?
Perhaps it's time I formed a new thesis about presidents, their infidelities and effectiveness....
Well you do have to take into account that JFK was a pretty crappy president, so I don't think your thesis would work out.
:rofl2:
Hmmm... I think you're onto something.... perhaps we should make it a mandatory element of the presidency to have a personal harem. They would be too busy to get up to any other type of mischief ..... and it would be one hell of a job perk! :thumbsup:
:glugglug:
Spitzer / Edwards 2008!
Or maybe they just never got caught at it? But granted some of them you jusy don't see it like Carter and Dubya.But I think maybe it shows that it don't matter you can be good prez and do those things and you can be bad prez who doesn't and vice-a-versa.Really why is it our buisness to know such things or really care I guess.BTW IKE had a mistress too while he was the big general in Europe.
What two consenting adults do behind closed doors is their business. This is bad for McCain because how he treated his first wife is rather shameful, not to mention illegal.
I wasn't shocked when I heard about FDR... haven't you seen pictures of his wife... yikes. I don't blame him.
Personally, I think Dubya is tapping a little Condi on the side.
I wasn't shocked when I heard about FDR... haven't you seen pictures of his wife... yikes. I don't blame him.
Personally, I think Dubya is tapping a little Condi on the side.