Ronald Reagan
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May God have mercy on his soul, and I hope his ****** overcomes their grief quickly.
That's the kindest thing I have to say about the man.
Now, a few of my favorite reasons to despise not the man -- as all accounts suggest he was charming -- but what he stood for as my nation's leader, and a guy that some psychos are actually thinking of putting on our currency.
1) He NAMED NAMES as an actor testifying before Joe McCarthy's House Unamerican Activities Commission hearings -- arguably the lowest point in American political discourse of the 20th century. He ruined the careers (lives) of fellow actors and writers who would have called him a friend with unsubstantiated accusations. This made him a darling of the political set, and would set his rise to prominance in motion. I have more respect for convicted Watergate conspirator G. Gordon Liddy. At least Liddy didn't rat.
2) RE: TEAR DOWN THAT WALL... Give me a break. The Russians had been trying to make peace for years. Their economy was shot, all of the intelligence about their formidable defense technology was bullshit -- some of their fighter planes still had tube radios in them at that time, for god's sake. Reagan just plain refused to discuss disarmament with Gorby, and rode home on a white ***** claiming some kind of victory for toughness.
The soviet union finally collapsed when western banks that had loaned them money for years to prop up their economy called the notes. As a result, millions of everyday Russians -- who all of us on this board have more in common with than we do with hyper rich elitist "skull and bones" members of our own countries -- saw their standard of living actually drop substantially as a result of capitalism "winning", and the lovely murderous Russian gangs sprung up everywhere. Destablization in the region brought about the possibility of rogue military officials selling military secrets and hardware -- nuclear/chemical/biological/traditional -- to volitile extremist groups, Muslim, and otherwise.
Was getting rid of the Berlin Wall a good thing for the world? You bet it was. But Reagan had about as much to do with it as you or I, and what role he did play was to refuse an outstretched hand of good faith.
3) Fiscally Responsible Conservative? For the first time in our history we started running huge defecits during peace time. Rush Limbaugh say's it best. We'll be indebted to his presidency for ever. I'll ***** to that. To the tune of TRILLIONS of dollars in bogus defense spending (see Star Wars) and tax breaks for corporations and the rich. Trickle down economics was recognized as a farce by over 90% of the economic community when it was introduced, and even fewer professionals in the field give it any validity today. It just sounds nice, and could possibly work if you have an isolationist government that demand that the rich and companies doing business reinvest the funds domestically. But with Reagan's lovely deregulation of the banking and securities industries we saw failed savings and loans that stole retirees money, and the beginning of the off shore bank account craze that brought us to Enron and the like.
4) Star Wars: The single most expensive defense system ever concievied, and it has NEVER PRODUCED A SINGLE RESULT. Even if it were possible -- which most straight thinking scientists and engineers in the field question -- we haven't seen a single "ray ***" satellite get placed in position to knock out ICBM's. It was a totally imaginary research and development money hole that made defense contractors and other Republicans rich. (The same program that Condi Rice was scheduled to make a speech about beefing up on 9/11. But then, these planes hit a couple of buildings...)
5) IRAN CONTRA: Illegally selling arms to Iran, pocketing the cash, and then channelling it through black ops with NO congressional oversight (*******) in an effort to overthrow a democratically elected leader of a foreign country. (Sound familiar?) If you lived through it, you remember it. Of course Ronnie evidently couldn't, as he answered "I don't remember" over 100 times under oath. I wouldn't wish altzheimer's on my worst enemy, but if it was the reason for his forgetfullness in this case -- which I find very hard to believe -- it beats the hell out of Federal Prison for the rest of your life. He dodged the tougher of 2 bullets.
6) Reagan the ****** Values man? He left his first wife for Nancy Reagan. That scumbag Clinton has been married to the same woman for over 20 years, and they've raised a ******** who will be a leader one day. Which is a better role model for your country? They both obviously ran on their wives, but one couple chose to do the hard thing and stay committed to each other.
And that's just scratching the surface. In response to the American media's orgy of praise for this man, here's 66 unflattering but factually correct things about his presidency:
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The man was evidently suffering for years, and putting his ****** through hell as a result, so his death was a blessing for all involved. Now we just have to try to undo his work...
That's the kindest thing I have to say about the man.
Now, a few of my favorite reasons to despise not the man -- as all accounts suggest he was charming -- but what he stood for as my nation's leader, and a guy that some psychos are actually thinking of putting on our currency.
1) He NAMED NAMES as an actor testifying before Joe McCarthy's House Unamerican Activities Commission hearings -- arguably the lowest point in American political discourse of the 20th century. He ruined the careers (lives) of fellow actors and writers who would have called him a friend with unsubstantiated accusations. This made him a darling of the political set, and would set his rise to prominance in motion. I have more respect for convicted Watergate conspirator G. Gordon Liddy. At least Liddy didn't rat.
2) RE: TEAR DOWN THAT WALL... Give me a break. The Russians had been trying to make peace for years. Their economy was shot, all of the intelligence about their formidable defense technology was bullshit -- some of their fighter planes still had tube radios in them at that time, for god's sake. Reagan just plain refused to discuss disarmament with Gorby, and rode home on a white ***** claiming some kind of victory for toughness.
The soviet union finally collapsed when western banks that had loaned them money for years to prop up their economy called the notes. As a result, millions of everyday Russians -- who all of us on this board have more in common with than we do with hyper rich elitist "skull and bones" members of our own countries -- saw their standard of living actually drop substantially as a result of capitalism "winning", and the lovely murderous Russian gangs sprung up everywhere. Destablization in the region brought about the possibility of rogue military officials selling military secrets and hardware -- nuclear/chemical/biological/traditional -- to volitile extremist groups, Muslim, and otherwise.
Was getting rid of the Berlin Wall a good thing for the world? You bet it was. But Reagan had about as much to do with it as you or I, and what role he did play was to refuse an outstretched hand of good faith.
3) Fiscally Responsible Conservative? For the first time in our history we started running huge defecits during peace time. Rush Limbaugh say's it best. We'll be indebted to his presidency for ever. I'll ***** to that. To the tune of TRILLIONS of dollars in bogus defense spending (see Star Wars) and tax breaks for corporations and the rich. Trickle down economics was recognized as a farce by over 90% of the economic community when it was introduced, and even fewer professionals in the field give it any validity today. It just sounds nice, and could possibly work if you have an isolationist government that demand that the rich and companies doing business reinvest the funds domestically. But with Reagan's lovely deregulation of the banking and securities industries we saw failed savings and loans that stole retirees money, and the beginning of the off shore bank account craze that brought us to Enron and the like.
4) Star Wars: The single most expensive defense system ever concievied, and it has NEVER PRODUCED A SINGLE RESULT. Even if it were possible -- which most straight thinking scientists and engineers in the field question -- we haven't seen a single "ray ***" satellite get placed in position to knock out ICBM's. It was a totally imaginary research and development money hole that made defense contractors and other Republicans rich. (The same program that Condi Rice was scheduled to make a speech about beefing up on 9/11. But then, these planes hit a couple of buildings...)
5) IRAN CONTRA: Illegally selling arms to Iran, pocketing the cash, and then channelling it through black ops with NO congressional oversight (*******) in an effort to overthrow a democratically elected leader of a foreign country. (Sound familiar?) If you lived through it, you remember it. Of course Ronnie evidently couldn't, as he answered "I don't remember" over 100 times under oath. I wouldn't wish altzheimer's on my worst enemy, but if it was the reason for his forgetfullness in this case -- which I find very hard to believe -- it beats the hell out of Federal Prison for the rest of your life. He dodged the tougher of 2 bullets.
6) Reagan the ****** Values man? He left his first wife for Nancy Reagan. That scumbag Clinton has been married to the same woman for over 20 years, and they've raised a ******** who will be a leader one day. Which is a better role model for your country? They both obviously ran on their wives, but one couple chose to do the hard thing and stay committed to each other.
And that's just scratching the surface. In response to the American media's orgy of praise for this man, here's 66 unflattering but factually correct things about his presidency:
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The man was evidently suffering for years, and putting his ****** through hell as a result, so his death was a blessing for all involved. Now we just have to try to undo his work...
Those are some good points... I'd forgotten about the "naming names" one myself. As for the 66 unflatering things, I do feel it necessary to point out that you could easily compile similar lists on other so-called "great" Presidents. I've heard many a pundit say Bill Clinton is one of the greatest ever. How long would his list be?
Just a few for fun: MFN trade status for China, welfare "reform," health care reform, Somalia, Rickey Ray Rector (yes, he was Govenor at the time, but his actions were too loathsome for me to ignore).
See what I mean?
Just a few for fun: MFN trade status for China, welfare "reform," health care reform, Somalia, Rickey Ray Rector (yes, he was Govenor at the time, but his actions were too loathsome for me to ignore).
See what I mean?
President Reagan was perhaps the greatest American President of the 20th Century. His vision brought down the Soviet Empire and reunited East and West Germany. Also, Reagan went on a military spending spree that made our military capable of reaching into any part of the world to show our power to protect democracy and freedom. He will be missed by all.
If I may supply an addendum to my previous comments, I'd like to cite this article I found about Bill Clinton and his greatest "achievement," transforming the Democratic Party from a party of ideals to a party of Republican wannabees. I'm a "new" Democrat Bill would say, his eyes glowing green with dollar signs. I'm constantly amazed at how many liberal members of the media become orgastic whilst talking about Bill and his leagacy for the party.
BTW, here's the article I mentioned above. It was written shortly after the 2002 federal elections.
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BTW, here's the article I mentioned above. It was written shortly after the 2002 federal elections.
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clinton will never be as famous as ronald regan because first he wasn't so determined and strong minded as reagan. ronald is the Example of what is a great president an what a great president should be.Clinton he is just an average president with no charism and no class, just a weakminded person like kerry and co that is what i think.
Parker, agreed wholeheartedly that Clinton isn't my idea of the perfect president. And it's arguable that I erred in mentioning his name in my Reagan diatribe. Reagan was a loser without bringing Clinton into the mix, and it was foolish of me to bring him up, because he is the republican whipping boy.
But since you're hammering him, I'll defend him...
Most favored nation status for China... That's a big money issue, and Reagan would have done the same thing. Clinton caved to the neocons, the pussy. (More likely: the reality of contemporary American politics. Make the money boys happy, or you don't get the white house.)
What is it exactly that was wrong with welfare "reform"? He pushed for work for money.
Health care reform: Again, what exactly is wrong with every American getting health care coverage when it's the standard in most industrialized countries? (Coming from a college educated man who hasn't had health care for years and will probably die younger because of it?) Is it possible that HMO's and their stockholders might not make so much money if they actually cover/serve folks who might need the coverage?
Somalia: It was a tragedy. What should he have done differently? How would Ronald Reagan have made Somalia a happy story? We were there to prop up a puppett regime that was not addressing the needs of it's people, and damn near the entire city was happy to **** our boys who were trying to defend it. A true tragedy for our brave soldiers and their families, but we never should have been there in the first place. The very people we were supposedly bringing "freedom" were the ones who wanted no part of us. Only the rich puppets wanted us there, and Clinton inherited that.
Ricky Ray Rector? I'm not sure what you're referencing. If you mean that Clinton ok'd the death of a brain damaged guy who ****** two people, including a cop, I agree with you wholeheartedly. The death penalty is bullshit, and Reagan supported it, which is a reason to dislike him that I forgot about. Thanks!
FYI: Republican George Bush set a record for most executions ok'd by a governor. (Maybe I'm just ignorant, but the only guy I know of who refused to execute folks on principle as governor was Democrat Dukkakis (sp?), who failed miserably as a presidential candidate and has an ego as big as all of out doors, but I'll always give him that.)
An aside: Here's a rather interesting link to bios and the final statements of the 232 people Bush ****** in Texas during his reign as governor. Judge whether you thought they should have been ****** yourself. ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Laibach: I contend that our military doesn't promote true democracy anywhere, and hasn't since WWII. (Not the soldier's fault; the politicians are to blame.) Our military, which spends more than the next 6 countries combined, has been hijacked.
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It protects neocon corporate interests which aren't in any way concerned about democracy or "freedom", whatever that means. In fact, the last thing that the monied elite wants is for regular working stiffs like you and me to have the freedom to question why 1% of the world population owns over 95% of the wealth, or anything else.
IF REPUBLICAN ATTOURNEY GENERAL JOHN ASHCROFT HAD HIS WAY, YOU WOULD BE A CRIMINAL FOR LOOKING AT/PROMOTING PORN ON THE INTERNET, AND DEFINITELY FOR READING MY WORDS. Now there's your Republican "freedom". And Ronnie was more than happy to align himself with like thinkers.
Re: Reunification of Germany. Depending on your point of view, either 40 years of American troops in Germany OR the German people themselved (my view) reunited East and West Germany, not Ronald Reagan.
And Reagan will not be missed by the families of the people his policies ******, nor by anyone who either isn't a millionaire or a Republican Uncle Tom. I used to be a white Uncle Tom myself until I started doing the math. A Republican is either an obscenely wealthy person (which I understand), or ill informed. I'm not saying you're stupid, I'm simply asking that you broaden your scope of reading/viewing. Here are some links that may prove helpful:
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I'll make you this promise. If you read the info found there, I'll be happy to read any pages you post here. Hopefully the process will bring us closer together!
Re: LIBERAL MEDIA?! If only that were so. The founding fathers wouldn't be spinning in their graves right now. They took great pains to insure that the media could provide a watchdog function to prevent powerful ****** bent on subverting democracy from manipulating the political process. Today, the vast majority of media outlets in America are owned by a small group of Republicans who regularly toe the party line. And the worst is "Fair and Balanced" Fox ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Even the National Association of Broadcasters -- once a stallwart supporter of the little guy -- commits over 60% of it's political money to republicans, who then in turn make it easier for their cronies to absorb independent media outlets. (Do a google search for FCC regs.) At the current rate, one guy will end up owning every tv station, radio station, and newspaper in the country. And that guy very well could be Rupert Murdock, an Australian. ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Georges: Again I applaude your heart. And you bring up a point that I definitely agree with. Reagan certainly was determined and strong minded in the sense that he stuck to his guns. But just because someone sticks to their guns doesn't make them right. Hitler was one of the strongest minded and focussed thinkers of 20th century politics. Did that make him right?
Here's an interesting comparison between what has happened in the US since 911, and what happened in Germany in 1933. Premium Link Upgrade (Nothing to do with Reagan, but if the Bush administration wants to feed off of his corpse, all Repubs are fair game in my book.)
Sorry this went in so many directions, but it all can be connected to Ronnie's work in the 80's.
:hatsoff:
Ex Republican Uncle Tom
But since you're hammering him, I'll defend him...
Most favored nation status for China... That's a big money issue, and Reagan would have done the same thing. Clinton caved to the neocons, the pussy. (More likely: the reality of contemporary American politics. Make the money boys happy, or you don't get the white house.)
What is it exactly that was wrong with welfare "reform"? He pushed for work for money.
Health care reform: Again, what exactly is wrong with every American getting health care coverage when it's the standard in most industrialized countries? (Coming from a college educated man who hasn't had health care for years and will probably die younger because of it?) Is it possible that HMO's and their stockholders might not make so much money if they actually cover/serve folks who might need the coverage?
Somalia: It was a tragedy. What should he have done differently? How would Ronald Reagan have made Somalia a happy story? We were there to prop up a puppett regime that was not addressing the needs of it's people, and damn near the entire city was happy to **** our boys who were trying to defend it. A true tragedy for our brave soldiers and their families, but we never should have been there in the first place. The very people we were supposedly bringing "freedom" were the ones who wanted no part of us. Only the rich puppets wanted us there, and Clinton inherited that.
Ricky Ray Rector? I'm not sure what you're referencing. If you mean that Clinton ok'd the death of a brain damaged guy who ****** two people, including a cop, I agree with you wholeheartedly. The death penalty is bullshit, and Reagan supported it, which is a reason to dislike him that I forgot about. Thanks!
FYI: Republican George Bush set a record for most executions ok'd by a governor. (Maybe I'm just ignorant, but the only guy I know of who refused to execute folks on principle as governor was Democrat Dukkakis (sp?), who failed miserably as a presidential candidate and has an ego as big as all of out doors, but I'll always give him that.)
An aside: Here's a rather interesting link to bios and the final statements of the 232 people Bush ****** in Texas during his reign as governor. Judge whether you thought they should have been ****** yourself. ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Laibach: I contend that our military doesn't promote true democracy anywhere, and hasn't since WWII. (Not the soldier's fault; the politicians are to blame.) Our military, which spends more than the next 6 countries combined, has been hijacked.
( Premium Link Upgrade )
It protects neocon corporate interests which aren't in any way concerned about democracy or "freedom", whatever that means. In fact, the last thing that the monied elite wants is for regular working stiffs like you and me to have the freedom to question why 1% of the world population owns over 95% of the wealth, or anything else.
IF REPUBLICAN ATTOURNEY GENERAL JOHN ASHCROFT HAD HIS WAY, YOU WOULD BE A CRIMINAL FOR LOOKING AT/PROMOTING PORN ON THE INTERNET, AND DEFINITELY FOR READING MY WORDS. Now there's your Republican "freedom". And Ronnie was more than happy to align himself with like thinkers.
Re: Reunification of Germany. Depending on your point of view, either 40 years of American troops in Germany OR the German people themselved (my view) reunited East and West Germany, not Ronald Reagan.
And Reagan will not be missed by the families of the people his policies ******, nor by anyone who either isn't a millionaire or a Republican Uncle Tom. I used to be a white Uncle Tom myself until I started doing the math. A Republican is either an obscenely wealthy person (which I understand), or ill informed. I'm not saying you're stupid, I'm simply asking that you broaden your scope of reading/viewing. Here are some links that may prove helpful:
Premium Link Upgrade
I'll make you this promise. If you read the info found there, I'll be happy to read any pages you post here. Hopefully the process will bring us closer together!
Re: LIBERAL MEDIA?! If only that were so. The founding fathers wouldn't be spinning in their graves right now. They took great pains to insure that the media could provide a watchdog function to prevent powerful ****** bent on subverting democracy from manipulating the political process. Today, the vast majority of media outlets in America are owned by a small group of Republicans who regularly toe the party line. And the worst is "Fair and Balanced" Fox ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Even the National Association of Broadcasters -- once a stallwart supporter of the little guy -- commits over 60% of it's political money to republicans, who then in turn make it easier for their cronies to absorb independent media outlets. (Do a google search for FCC regs.) At the current rate, one guy will end up owning every tv station, radio station, and newspaper in the country. And that guy very well could be Rupert Murdock, an Australian. ( Premium Link Upgrade )
Georges: Again I applaude your heart. And you bring up a point that I definitely agree with. Reagan certainly was determined and strong minded in the sense that he stuck to his guns. But just because someone sticks to their guns doesn't make them right. Hitler was one of the strongest minded and focussed thinkers of 20th century politics. Did that make him right?
Here's an interesting comparison between what has happened in the US since 911, and what happened in Germany in 1933. Premium Link Upgrade (Nothing to do with Reagan, but if the Bush administration wants to feed off of his corpse, all Repubs are fair game in my book.)
Sorry this went in so many directions, but it all can be connected to Ronnie's work in the 80's.
:hatsoff:
Ex Republican Uncle Tom
The misunderstanding was all mine, Parker. It's just so seldom one finds a truely progressive thinker as yourself. A refreshing sight.
Just how far left do you go? I'm not sure where I'm at yet. I go at least as far left as Andrew Jackson when he condemned the creation of corporations. (You gotta like a president who has chickens in his yard!)
I'm actually for food, clothing, shelter, medical attention and national defense, all scaled down substantially from what the average American thinks is middle class, as a birth right. Something ala the Military or Catholic Church's monk approach to communal living. It's cheap to do, in many cases a very efficient use of resources, and builds community. Just don't expect to have 5 cel phones, onstar, and $200 gym shoes for your ****.
And before the greedy among us start worrying, in this proposed system you don't HAVE to live like that. If you want 3 vacation homes, make the kind of committment required to get it and go for it. But just don't make me the labor/income source to get it for you. I've had my fill of working 50+ hours per week to make someone else rich.
Too radical, P? Or in line with where you're coming from?
Just how far left do you go? I'm not sure where I'm at yet. I go at least as far left as Andrew Jackson when he condemned the creation of corporations. (You gotta like a president who has chickens in his yard!)
I'm actually for food, clothing, shelter, medical attention and national defense, all scaled down substantially from what the average American thinks is middle class, as a birth right. Something ala the Military or Catholic Church's monk approach to communal living. It's cheap to do, in many cases a very efficient use of resources, and builds community. Just don't expect to have 5 cel phones, onstar, and $200 gym shoes for your ****.
And before the greedy among us start worrying, in this proposed system you don't HAVE to live like that. If you want 3 vacation homes, make the kind of committment required to get it and go for it. But just don't make me the labor/income source to get it for you. I've had my fill of working 50+ hours per week to make someone else rich.
Too radical, P? Or in line with where you're coming from?
foxfilm said:
I started a thread some time ago, asking where everybody ranks themselves on the political spectrum.
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As for my take on corporations, I think a very interesting thread to read would be the one regarding the recent AIDS outbreak in the adult industry. In fact, it's a very interesting thread to read in general if you have the time.
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As for my "progressive" views, I attribute that to having lived in more than one country during my lifetime. It's allowed me to draw my opinions from more than one perspective.
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I really miss him and now nancy reagan
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