*Is Free Speech Dead ?*
- Thread starter Dinalt
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Why the hell wouldn't anyone say anything to the other mods? WHile I was away.. i wasn't away.. i just wasn't posting.. I was checking the mod section and validating pictures. i was doing that every day or so. Since i wasn't posting I didn't see 001 doing good stuff.
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The only thing in the mod section about this....
4-11
Two members have PMd or IMd me claiming that 001 is Lord Raven
I did find another thread where Freeones wanted us to help him hunt down LR's other accounts. That was 03-04.
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This whole thing feels like a secret deal, how was I suppose to know about it?
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The only thing in the mod section about this....
4-11
Two members have PMd or IMd me claiming that 001 is Lord Raven
I did find another thread where Freeones wanted us to help him hunt down LR's other accounts. That was 03-04.
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This whole thing feels like a secret deal, how was I suppose to know about it?
I didnt know how much or how little thfcmad was communicating to others. I assumed everyone knew about it. If the deal is not worth the screen its typed on fair enough, but please dont anyone have a go at/about thfcmad over this. He was trying to sort out something that was to the advantage of the board, which was working pretty well.
I can't explain why things weren't communicated... all I can do is provide you with the tangible proof that the conversation did indeed take place and that I have said record of that proof, bro. ALL of us agreed to the terms; some reluctantly, some wholeheartedly. Everything was going just fine until two, almost three days ago when 001 was ******.
If you need more of the conversation, please let me know. I'll be happy to provide it to you.
:thumbsup: :hatsoff: :bowdown:
If you need more of the conversation, please let me know. I'll be happy to provide it to you.
:thumbsup: :hatsoff: :bowdown:
Look, I can't remember any agreement from my side, I am sorry. I knew you were here (like i told you last tues), but I didn't know what the problem was with you, which is why I let it go. I am not the banning type, mostly, and b/c you weren't annoying here, I decided to let it go. A few ***** things happened two weeks ago, in the Phil77/Digital/001 conflict. Those little things were bothering me, but not enough to ban one of you.
After LR/001/#/#/#/#/ was/were ******, many other accounts were started by the same person, posting a lot of crap and spamming his own 'board'. Quite a good reason for a ban I'd say.
Anyway, I am neutral towards you being allowed back. My permissions as an admin allow me to unban you but I'm not too positive about that at this point. I have to think about it or hear what the other mods have to say about it.
After LR/001/#/#/#/#/ was/were ******, many other accounts were started by the same person, posting a lot of crap and spamming his own 'board'. Quite a good reason for a ban I'd say.
Anyway, I am neutral towards you being allowed back. My permissions as an admin allow me to unban you but I'm not too positive about that at this point. I have to think about it or hear what the other mods have to say about it.
Who runs this board. Who has the last word? Who helps run the board. Figue that out and you all will know what i'm thinking about right now.
I do think if this "deal" was talked about in the mod section, we all would know where the admins stand on it. The only admin i've asked about this deal, doesn't remember it at all. (as she said above me as i was making this post)
I do think if this "deal" was talked about in the mod section, we all would know where the admins stand on it. The only admin i've asked about this deal, doesn't remember it at all. (as she said above me as i was making this post)
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Winter said:
During my time on Freeones I have never formed any allegiances and have always remained impartial, simply preferring to post and discuss where I feel fit. As a result I have never been involved in any of the aforementioned disputes.
However as some now know, I have decided to take a ***** stance on this subject.
I personally feel that this is one of the best posts I have read during my time here. I can only applaud 001 on his genuine honesty.
I just want to appeal to the good nature of the moderating team here to give 001 the benefit of the doubt. Dont take rash action until you have all discussed the matter further.
I understand that the moderating team have the final word but surely the opinion of the majority here cannot be summarily dismissed.
Miyagi-san out :glugglug:
You have the PROOF in your hands, FamousBabes.
You need to get ahold of the one person who can truly confirm of all this - thfcmad.... the Moderator who gave his approval.
I'm not at all used to being quite so summarily dismissed in the manner in which I was spoken to in that private message, but all I can say is that you have PROOF... undeniable, verifiable PROOf that the conversation took place. There should be no more questions or doubts.
Do the right thing. It's about HONOR.
You need to get ahold of the one person who can truly confirm of all this - thfcmad.... the Moderator who gave his approval.
I'm not at all used to being quite so summarily dismissed in the manner in which I was spoken to in that private message, but all I can say is that you have PROOF... undeniable, verifiable PROOf that the conversation took place. There should be no more questions or doubts.
Do the right thing. It's about HONOR.
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Only way I can prove myself is to be allowed to post. If people have personal issues against me then by all means Neg Rep me or PM or whatever. My yahoo and MSN are available to anyone who wants to thrash anything out. I dont know how much more I can do. Like I said, you have my unreserved apologies for anything I have said or done that has upset people, and most people I have sorted this out on a one to one basis.
The ball is in your court, guys and gals.
The ball is in your court, guys and gals.
Proof? Proof of what. Of nighfly saying he won't mess with LR.QBall1970 said:
LR said he had a conversation with a mod. It's not in there.
AGAIN, it doesn't matter if he had a agreement with a mod. If it was only one mod, it was wrong for that mod to do it. It's not up to the mods to unban people.. sheesh.
Famousbabes said:
I think maybe the deal with thfcmad is besides the point right now. I was under the impression this held more weight than it clearly did. The deal served a good cause to resolve long term enmity with a lot of members, so that I personally consider a good thing, but also maybe irrelevant now here. Marie I am guessing is pretty much the admin of the board side of things, so I assume it is her call on what happens with the 001 account.
I hope a decision is reached that restores the board to how good it has been this last few weeks.
Thoughts on 001/Raven/Free Speech...
Marie, Famousbabes, FreeOnes, and fellow members:
Firstly, FB and I have been friends for quite some time. I cannot reach the man anymore. He has disabled PMing and never shows up online in Yahoo or MSN when I'm there, so alerting him to this situation was not something I could have done. Trust me, as much as I worked with FB in the past when the Raven-Hunt was on, when 001 first popped up, I was all over it -- but I couldn't reach FB.
As to Marie, when 001 first came up and I IDed him, I PMed Marie about it, requesting a read receipt. The title of my PM was 001 = Lord Raven. That PM was sent about 2 months ago. I checked it around the time thfcmad and 001 and I had our "deal" to call off the "hunt." Marie either read my PM and didn't confirm receipt or she never read it. For all I know, it's still in her inbox or has been deleted.
I certainly have no authority to "make a deal" to ALLOW someone here, and I wish people would stop describing it as such. It sounds silly. "Nightfly and thfcmad had a deal to allow 001 to stay." I have no power to make such a decision, guys and gals. I only have my opinions on the matter. That's one of the reasons why 001 and thfcmad and I sat down via MSN and hammered out a truce. My understanding was that it was to be a quiet deal so that my friends and his friends would no longer badger and bait each other, take cheap shots at each other, etc. and that while we knew 001 to be Raven, we would let things lie since he had been a positive new member.
Additionally, I can only say that the parties involved in the prior ugliness with the Lord Raven persona have embraced the change as seen in 001. We've set aside our differences, talked about the mess that happened last year, and we're completely willing to get along with (and even enjoy) each other again. But that's not really what's important here. What's important is whether or not the administrator/board owner decides to let 001 stay.
We speak of free speech here in this thread and the issue of bans, etc. I am a great proponent of free speech, but WITHIN ESTABLISHED RULES. I know some will differ with me about this, but my opinion is this -- we DO NOT have a RIGHT to say whatever we want here, nor does FreeOnes HAVE to allow us to say whatever we want here. Message boards are NOT democratically elected fora where "majority rules." Message boards are little dictatorships or kingdoms. What the owner says GOES. The same applies to membership. Anyone an administrator does not want on the board can be ****** at his/her sole discretion, or by proxy through a moderator carrying out the admin's wishes.
All we can do, as members, and even some moderators who see the redemption of Lord Raven as 001, is voice our opinions and try to INFLUENCE the "king." I think 001 has shown himself a more mature and respectful person, a constructive and fun-loving poster, and valued member.
Lastly, and this is a topic which is a proximate result of all this and the Lisa Sparxxx scenario which unfolded over the last few days, is the issue of moderator consistency. It's been discussed already recently, and I hope it will be further still -- it's a tough issue, trying to get different people from different parts of the world and different tolerance levels to all apply rules equally to members and ***** members.
As an example of the consistency issue, we had members going to and fro with Lisa in the thread which was deleted, flaming all over the place, and one mod posted (right in the middle of all the hand grenades being tossed around!!!) "Great links, Lisa! Thanks!" or something like that, completely oblivious to the thread and its content!!! My JAW DROPPED when I saw that. Only after several bad post reports for flaming did someone else (mod) intervene.
I've got to wrap up this message, because it's getting so long that people might not read the whole thing. lol The bottom line seems to be this -- admin, mods, and members alike ALL want this to be a fun, enjoyable, and interesting place to read, post, and experience others and their opinions. I think we can pretty much all agree on that. 001 certainly embraces that and has long abandoned his shitty old ways. Call me a fool or naive, but I am a believer in forgiveness and redemption. And yes, I was directly involved in having MANY of Lord Raven's user IDs ******, so you might be shocked that I would embrace his return. The thing is that he is NOT coming back as Lord Raven. He's turned over a new leaf, so to speak, and I think maybe some consideration might be made of the redeeming qualities and posts to his credit as 001.
That's my :2 cents: for now.
Respectfully submitted,
Nightfly
Marie, Famousbabes, FreeOnes, and fellow members:
Firstly, FB and I have been friends for quite some time. I cannot reach the man anymore. He has disabled PMing and never shows up online in Yahoo or MSN when I'm there, so alerting him to this situation was not something I could have done. Trust me, as much as I worked with FB in the past when the Raven-Hunt was on, when 001 first popped up, I was all over it -- but I couldn't reach FB.
As to Marie, when 001 first came up and I IDed him, I PMed Marie about it, requesting a read receipt. The title of my PM was 001 = Lord Raven. That PM was sent about 2 months ago. I checked it around the time thfcmad and 001 and I had our "deal" to call off the "hunt." Marie either read my PM and didn't confirm receipt or she never read it. For all I know, it's still in her inbox or has been deleted.
I certainly have no authority to "make a deal" to ALLOW someone here, and I wish people would stop describing it as such. It sounds silly. "Nightfly and thfcmad had a deal to allow 001 to stay." I have no power to make such a decision, guys and gals. I only have my opinions on the matter. That's one of the reasons why 001 and thfcmad and I sat down via MSN and hammered out a truce. My understanding was that it was to be a quiet deal so that my friends and his friends would no longer badger and bait each other, take cheap shots at each other, etc. and that while we knew 001 to be Raven, we would let things lie since he had been a positive new member.
Additionally, I can only say that the parties involved in the prior ugliness with the Lord Raven persona have embraced the change as seen in 001. We've set aside our differences, talked about the mess that happened last year, and we're completely willing to get along with (and even enjoy) each other again. But that's not really what's important here. What's important is whether or not the administrator/board owner decides to let 001 stay.
We speak of free speech here in this thread and the issue of bans, etc. I am a great proponent of free speech, but WITHIN ESTABLISHED RULES. I know some will differ with me about this, but my opinion is this -- we DO NOT have a RIGHT to say whatever we want here, nor does FreeOnes HAVE to allow us to say whatever we want here. Message boards are NOT democratically elected fora where "majority rules." Message boards are little dictatorships or kingdoms. What the owner says GOES. The same applies to membership. Anyone an administrator does not want on the board can be ****** at his/her sole discretion, or by proxy through a moderator carrying out the admin's wishes.
All we can do, as members, and even some moderators who see the redemption of Lord Raven as 001, is voice our opinions and try to INFLUENCE the "king." I think 001 has shown himself a more mature and respectful person, a constructive and fun-loving poster, and valued member.
Lastly, and this is a topic which is a proximate result of all this and the Lisa Sparxxx scenario which unfolded over the last few days, is the issue of moderator consistency. It's been discussed already recently, and I hope it will be further still -- it's a tough issue, trying to get different people from different parts of the world and different tolerance levels to all apply rules equally to members and ***** members.
As an example of the consistency issue, we had members going to and fro with Lisa in the thread which was deleted, flaming all over the place, and one mod posted (right in the middle of all the hand grenades being tossed around!!!) "Great links, Lisa! Thanks!" or something like that, completely oblivious to the thread and its content!!! My JAW DROPPED when I saw that. Only after several bad post reports for flaming did someone else (mod) intervene.
I've got to wrap up this message, because it's getting so long that people might not read the whole thing. lol The bottom line seems to be this -- admin, mods, and members alike ALL want this to be a fun, enjoyable, and interesting place to read, post, and experience others and their opinions. I think we can pretty much all agree on that. 001 certainly embraces that and has long abandoned his shitty old ways. Call me a fool or naive, but I am a believer in forgiveness and redemption. And yes, I was directly involved in having MANY of Lord Raven's user IDs ******, so you might be shocked that I would embrace his return. The thing is that he is NOT coming back as Lord Raven. He's turned over a new leaf, so to speak, and I think maybe some consideration might be made of the redeeming qualities and posts to his credit as 001.
That's my :2 cents: for now.
Respectfully submitted,
Nightfly
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Famousbabes said:
Do you want the entire transcript? I can very easily provide that to you, you know. A lot more discussion went on than just the five minutes' worth I sent to you via p.m.
Y'know... I really don't want to argue with you, FamousBabes. It solves nothing. I mean, I know how it will end up if I keep on pushing the issue: me being ****** for arguing and being combative and breaking the "rules". Seems like that's the answer to all the problems on this board.... ban 'em! So... YOU win. I'll hush and go to the quiet corner like a good little boy.
All I can say is that there is more than one person coming forward to verify what I posted. And that should count for something.
I said my piece. 'Nuff said.
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