Conservatives Want To Get Rid Of DOE

[ban-one]

I have heard of it and I think it should be illegal. Most home schooled kids receive terrible educations. Maybe home schooling is ok for the elementary level but not for high school. How many parents can properly teach English, History, Math and Science at the high school level? Practically none.

You think it should be illegal to home school your kid? Who are you to say a parent can't teach their children? That's meddling on the level of a fascist regime. In fact, I believe many of those very regimes made government schools the only option so they could indoctrinate the children for their needs.

I don't know what data you've seen, but the data I've seen say that home schooled kids actually get a far better education than the public schooled children because their teacher, their parent, really cares about them getting an education.

So, by your statement that home schooling is okay for elementary school and not high school, and that the parents can't properly teach the subjects, you believe the parents only have a elementary grade education?

Probably more parents can properly teach it than you'd give credit to, seeing as they were taught it and know it, and there's plenty of books at the library and resources on the internet to help.

 

[antanotherthing]

You think it should be illegal to home school your kid? Who are you to say a parent can't teach their children? That's meddling on the level of a fascist regime. In fact, I believe many of those very regimes made government schools the only option so they could indoctrinate the children for their needs.

I don't know what data you've seen, but the data I've seen say that home schooled kids actually get a far better education than the public schooled children because their teacher, their parent, really cares about them getting an education.

So, by your statement that home schooling is okay for elementary school and not high school, and that the parents can't properly teach the subjects, you believe the parents only have a elementary grade education?

Probably more parents can properly teach it than you'd give credit to, seeing as they were taught it and know it, and there's plenty of books at the library and resources on the internet to help.

I apologize for posting so much, but can you guess what I do for a living?

I come from Perry's wonderful state. You can teach high school here without a Master's Degree. I hate to be a snob, but I am a bit of an educational snob when it comes to edumacators.

Re: Home Schooling...It should absolutely be your right. I just think unless there is a good reason for it, it should be avoided. Education and child development is more than what is in a text book.

That is my opinion and I do not question parents who want to home school their own kids.

 

[No_Man]

I'm not arguing with your point of what might work. I just like to:

PDCA - Plan, Do, Check, Act

Measure twice, cut once

Look before I leap

...basically have a plan for how I'm going to improve education before taking away funding that many schools count on today (...and yes, I agree...it is less than ideal)

Oh, absolutely. I'm not saying it should done tomorrow. Just that it should be done and we should start now with the planning. Even if we decided to move forward with dissolving the Department of Education and Federal education funding immediately, it would probably take until at least 2013 to get it into the Federal budget, and probably just as long for the states to adjust their taxes accordingly.

 

[ban-one]

I think it's funny when people want to come along and undo something that was implemented before they were around.

That would be something only around since Carter signed it into law in 1979, and started in 1980. It's effectively 4 years older than I am. We were very fine without it for 200 years, and we'll be fine without it again.

Again the ideological aside, generally speaking there are likely reasons for the policy or changes like this to begin with.

Not changing the subject but offering an example;

After Hurricane Andrew (I think) Clinton saw a need for a change and elevated FEMA to a cabinet level agency. Things ticked along with the agency for years over the course of several other disasters.

Along comes Bush on the strength of ideologues urging him to do away with the agency altogether (ala Bachmann here). He placates them by rolling the agency up into DHS....then Katrina.

Now Katrina could have been the disaster it became one way or the other...but we know FEMA failed it's function.

Point...sometimes it's better to just leave things as they are (ideology aside) when a change is made to get some policy where it is. (It was probably for a reason that you have forgotten or aren't considering.)

But we're not better now with the DOE than we were before, we are in fact worse. Education in this country fell under the cliche of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it," and they 'fixed' it anyway with the DOE to amass power in DC. One more step closer to what we declared our independence from.

And I could go off on FEMA, but that would be off topic, so I won't. But I will ask this, how did Bush placate anyone who wanted to get rid of FEMA, by just rolling it into something else? If you want it gone, you want it gone, not just lumped in with another dept or agency and still there. To me, rolling FEMA into DHS is to give the dept responsible for homeland security(which I kinda think is and was the job of the military and intelligence services all along) the ability to respond to the after effects of an attack, or in your cited example, a natural disaster, seeing as you tend to need the same things after both and don't need duplication.

 

[ban-one]

I apologize for posting so much, but can you guess what I do for a living?

I have a pretty good idea what you do for a living, and don't apologize for expressing yourself. To quote (maybe that should be paraphrase as there are multiple versions) Leroy Jethro Giibbs' ('NCIS') quote of the Duke from 'She Wore a Yellow Ribbon,' "Don't apologize. It's a sign of weakness."

Re: Home Schooling...It should absolutely be your right. I just think unless there is a good reason for it, it should be avoided. Education and child development is more than what is in a text book.

That is my opinion and I do not question parents who want to home school their own kids.

If you're talking about the kids interacting with others, there's nothing stopping them from making friends with neighbor kids their age, or being on a team, in fact, many school districts allow home-schooled kids in their districts to play on their teams. Besides, the parents can give their kids practical life lessons by taking them shopping to interact with people there, in addition to learning how to do all the things involved in shopping.

 

[MikeyK]

As for the Air Force and Coast Guard, the Coast Guard's the little sibling of the Navy and operates (or at least did, I'm not sure about now) as a part of the Navy during war time, and as they didn't have airplanes when the wrote the Constitution, of course no mention of an Air Force. Just Army and Navy. Land and Sea. But the Air Force can be seen as part of the military the US is supposed to have to protect us, and since they covered land and sea, why can't we expand a little further into air since that opened up? Or even space one day? And if you wanna be a real stickler, just roll the AF back into the Army where it started, or amend the Constitution to include the Air Force and Coast Guard. We can do that.

We can also amend the constitution to cover education.

It is funny that you try to create an excuse to allow for the air force. Even though it is legitimate and yes they didn't have airplanes at that time still the constitution makes no mention of an air force.

You are just a typical conservative that loves to use the constitution until it can be used against you and your positions. Then of course you want to amend it.

Are you saying all republicans are retarded or just the ones that want to get rid of the DOE?

I'm saying a large number of conservative republicans are ignorant.

You think it should be illegal to home school your kid? Who are you to say a parent can't teach their children? That's meddling on the level of a fascist regime. In fact, I believe many of those very regimes made government schools the only option so they could indoctrinate the children for their needs.

I don't know what data you've seen, but the data I've seen say that home schooled kids actually get a far better education than the public schooled children because their teacher, their parent, really cares about them getting an education.

So, by your statement that home schooling is okay for elementary school and not high school, and that the parents can't properly teach the subjects, you believe the parents only have a elementary grade education?

Probably more parents can properly teach it than you'd give credit to, seeing as they were taught it and know it, and there's plenty of books at the library and resources on the internet to help.

You'll have to show me facts or studies that show parents not only have the knowledge but also time to teach their kids full time. In high school some of the things I was taught included chemistry, physiology, algebra, geometry and calculus. I also took computer classes and auto shop. What parents do you know that can properly or even attempt to teach those topics?

 

[MikeyK]

If you're talking about the kids interacting with others, there's nothing stopping them from making friends with neighbor kids their age, or being on a team, in fact, many school districts allow home-schooled kids in their districts to play on their teams. Besides, the parents can give their kids practical life lessons by taking them shopping to interact with people there, in addition to learning how to do all the things involved in shopping.

There is no substitute for having your kids interact with other kids all day. There simply isn't. Home schooled kids are stuck at home with a parent for most of the day. They miss the group exercises that are often used in class and they miss out on the socializing that comes with gym and lunch.

 

[Hot Mega]

That would be something only around since Carter signed it into law in 1979, and started in 1980. It's effectively 4 years older than I am. We were very fine without it for 200 years, and we'll be fine without it again.

The function has been around for much longer than that. It was a part of HEW (Health, Ed, Welfare Dept.). Carter just separated it into a cabinet level agency creating two, separate depts.; DOE and HHS.:2 cents:

But we're not better now with the DOE than we were before, we are in fact worse. Education in this country fell under the cliche of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it," and they 'fixed' it anyway with the DOE to amass power in DC. One more step closer to what we declared our independence from.

And I could go off on FEMA, but that would be off topic, so I won't. But I will ask this, how did Bush placate anyone who wanted to get rid of FEMA, by just rolling it into something else? If you want it gone, you want it gone, not just lumped in with another dept or agency and still there. To me, rolling FEMA into DHS is to give the dept responsible for homeland security(which I kinda think is and was the job of the military and intelligence services all along) the ability to respond to the after effects of an attack, or in your cited example, a natural disaster, seeing as you tend to need the same things after both and don't need duplication.

I disagree with virtually everything in the above. I think it is missing a few facts and misunderstands others.

But I won't haggle with it as it's not the brunt of the topic. I would implore you though to read for yourself the history of FEMA and some of the GOPs erstwhile thoughts about it's future. F.Y.I...if you practically want to do away with a cabinet level entity, you don't whack it in one fell swoop for obvious reasons. But what you might want to do is roll it up in another agency that way you can erode it's function through duplicate efforts, etc. Then one day it's just gone.

 

[Facetious]

Q: What does the DOE have to show for itself over the last 31 years, Mr Kottah?

Adult Image Hosting

Wh:clown::yahoosy!

In the minds of the lefties:
The white male dominant America was simply too good for itself in the face of the rest of the world, we needed to do something to level the playing field so that all things have a greater chance of being equal... enter the DOE, yet another insidious and *expensive bureaucracy that was sold on good intentions.


Got history? √NO
Got science? √NO
Got Math? √NO
Got anything of redeeming quality? √NO
Mission accomplished!


*Per Wiki:

Employees 5,000 (2007)
Annual budget US$32 billion (2009)[1]
US$56 billion (est. 2010)
US$71 billion (est. 2011)
ARRA Funding:
US$102 billion (2009)[1]
US$51 billion (est. 2010)
US$23 billion (est. 2011)

Purge it!!!

 

[Jenkum]

Would we like to have the Government control our media?

Would we want the government to control what content we can and cannot view on the internet?

Would we like for them to tell us what foods we can and cant eat?


Then why would we want them controlling what our children learn? That is why we are so fucked as a country, because we let the government dictate what we learn in school, and what we are taught is the state dictated propaganda bullshit social engineering. Americans are the dumbest people to come from first world countries, the average American intelligence is the butt of jokes all over the world. Our education system has failed us.

The ruling elites wants large masses of morons that are easy to control, people will be happy slaves and good consumers, should we just let them turn our kids into what they want in these state run brainwashing camps. Or should we teach our kids to fight against these evil forces for the betterment of humanity?

Bachmann is the broken clock that is right twice a day

 

[Jenkum]

In the minds of the lefties:
The white male dominant America was simply too good for itself in the face of the rest of the world, we needed to do something to level the playing field so that all things have a greater chance of being equal... enter the DOE, yet another insidious and *expensive bureaucracy that was sold on good intentions.

Purge it!!!

In the minds of these leftys is the notion that White people must be bred out to extinction. That Western Civilization is intrinsically evil and oppresive of other races. These lefties are actually White supremecists because they themselves are saying whites are superior and they must pay for it by way of genocide. That other races cannot compete with whites on a level playing field so minorities must be given preferencial treatment with policies such as affirmative action and the like. Also, that a White country, civilization and culture is inherently evil if it remains the same racially as it has remained for thousands of years. That a white country must be flooded with non whites and if the people of the country have anything to say about they are labeled an evil racist. That the tax dollars of white people have to pay for their immigrant replacements. Its a sick and twisted world today

 

[MikeyK]

Would we like to have the Government control our media?

Would we want the government to control what content we can and cannot view on the internet?

Would we like for them to tell us what foods we can and cant eat?


Then why would we want them controlling what our children learn? That is why we are so fucked as a country, because we let the government dictate what we learn in school, and what we are taught is the state dictated propaganda bullshit social engineering. Americans are the dumbest people to come from first world countries, the average American intelligence is the butt of jokes all over the world. Our education system has failed us.

The ruling elites wants large masses of morons that are easy to control, people will be happy slaves and good consumers, should we just let them turn our kids into what they want in these state run brainwashing camps. Or should we teach our kids to fight against these evil forces for the betterment of humanity?

Bachmann is the broken clock that is right twice a day

No one wants government telling us what to do but sometimes it is necessary. We have laws for the good of society. Unfortunately the government does have to tell some people what to do because they to too irresponsible to do the right thing on their own. We have to post speed limits in school zones because assholes do not realize it is a bad idea to speed in school zones. Same thing for drinking and driving.

 

[Jenkum]

No one wants government telling us what to do but sometimes it is necessary. We have laws for the good of society. Unfortunately the government does have to tell some people what to do because they to too irresponsible to do the right thing on their own. We have to post speed limits in school zones because assholes do not realize it is a bad idea to speed in school zones. Same thing for drinking and driving.

So society has to reduce itself to the lowest common denominator. We all have to live by laws meant for the worst examples of our kind.

If society is healthy and government doesnt interfere in every aspect of our lives hindering our progress and development then it is possible for private citizens and humanitarians to take care of all the people on the bottom and then some. When we truly are free from many of the things holding us back and stifling progress we can achieve more than we ever imagined, there wouldnt be a need for any human on earth to go hungry or without clean water. When we hold back our best and brightest in order to let the stragglers try and catch up, we fuck ourselves and everyone.

 

[MikeyK]

So society has to reduce itself to the lowest common denominator. We all have to live by laws meant for the worst examples of our kind.

Unfortunately it isn't the lowest common denominator. Society as a whole is stupid. History has proven this repeatedly.

 

[meesterperfect]

I blame Brown VS The board of education for this mess.

 

[Hot Mega]

Would we like to have the Government control our media?

Would we want the government to control what content we can and cannot view on the internet?

Would we like for them to tell us what foods we can and cant eat?


Then why would we want them controlling what our children learn?

I don't know if you're doing this on purpose or you just don't know any better but conflating circumstances in which the g'ment controls access to apparatuses you choose for yourself with apparatuses they provide at 'no' cost is pretty disingenuous IMO. You have the right to choose what your children learn...who's stopping you from paying for that on your own? Don't say taxes are stopping you. That is an utter load of malarkey. If you are in a position where you don't have the means to provide your children with an education of your choosing..(financially) then what position are you in to criticize one being provided to you on a shared cost basis?? You ought to gladly take it and keep your mouth shut IMO. If you're in a position to decide what schooling system your children will learn from then certainly the menial taxation you pay shouldn't be a determinative factor.

You're acting as if there is some broad deference to what could be taught/learned to the degree that it makes some appreciable difference. The only real difference is in quality of some educations in comparisons to others from a material standpoint.

That is why we are so fucked as a country, because we let the government dictate what we learn in school, and what we are taught is the state dictated propaganda bullshit social engineering. Americans are the dumbest people to come from first world countries, the average American intelligence is the butt of jokes all over the world. Our education system has failed us.

Bullshit. Americans have failed themselves period the end. Just like in politics. In the US we have the right to chose our leaders...a circumstance that others would gladly die for ..yet what do we Americans do? We fritter away the right and allow our system of g'ment to be a mockery of the world. There is little difference with Education (or many of our g'ments other functions). The failure is with the people...there is no excuse for some of the complete and utter ignorance on display by Americans. The information is in the curriculum but there are simply far to many of us who see going to get an education which only requires us to show up as some sort of chore. That is a failing of 'we the people' not the institution. Sorry, you're just wildly off base on this one IMO.

The ruling elites wants large masses of morons that are easy to control, people will be happy slaves and good consumers, should we just let them turn our kids into what they want in these state run brainwashing camps. Or should we teach our kids to fight against these evil forces for the betterment of humanity?

Bachmann is the broken clock that is right twice a day

Wrong again.

 

[HeartBroker]

Michelle Bachmann is leading he fight to get rid of the Department of Education. Another fine idea from the retard republicans. Their argument is that it isn't listed in the Constitution. Many want education to be privatized.

I wonder how happy these voters will be when they have to pay 10k/year to send each child to private school?

Education is expensive.
Pay up or learn to take orders for french fries.

 

[Mr. Hyde]

I'm not a republican, but I'd be ok with this. Let the states educate their population as they see fit. The DOE is a money-wasting duplication of services. Why does it exist? What does it do? At the least, it should be cut back to a bare-bones organization that exists only to provide funding for university research.

 

[HeartBroker]

I'm not a republican, but I'd be ok with this. Let the states educate their population as they see fit. The DOE is a money-wasting duplication of services. Why does it exist? What does it do? At the least, it should be cut back to a bare-bones organization that exists only to provide funding for university research.

Rep to you, Sir!

 

[Hot Mega]

I'm not a republican, but I'd be ok with this. Let the states educate their population as they see fit.

They don't do this already?

Texas Conservatives Win Curriculum Change

AUSTIN, Tex. — After three days of turbulent meetings, the Texas Board of Education on Friday approved a social studies curriculum that will put a conservative stamp on history and economics textbooks, stressing the superiority of American capitalism, questioning the Founding Fathers’ commitment to a purely secular government and presenting Republican political philosophies in a more positive light.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/education/13texas.html

The DOE is a money-wasting duplication of services. Why does it exist?

It exists because education should be a national priority and as such should have some national organization. Now that is a point that can be agreed or disagreed with but it is a logical case.

What does it do? At the least, it should be cut back to a bare-bones organization that exists only to provide funding for university research.

Unfunded mandate 101.