Hello All. As an AF retiree I think the AF is spending to much money on expensive toys.
Thanks
Thanks
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What do you think about the USAF Purchasing the F22 Raptor ?
- Thread starter sidewinder101
- Start date
What do you think they should spend it on?
I personally think they should buy 3 or 4 squadrons of F-22's, plus an attrition reserve. So about 100-120 planes. But no more.
They spent all the money to develop the thing - and they are already starting to deploy it, I believe (at Andrews AFB for one, I think). They might as well equip enough squadrons to have it ready if they need it.
But several hundred? Unnecessary at this time, in my opinion. The F-15 and superior American training seems to be able to do the job nicely for the forseeable future.
But they should continue to spend much on Research and Development. Continue to fund new projects just in case some single or group of countries gets overtly hostile.
As I think our current generation of Jets is head and shoulders above anything else I think there is no need for new ones.This all goes back I think to a film I and AFA as well has mentioned called "Why we Fight" which begins with Eisenhower's address to the country as he was leaving the Presidency about the dangers of the "military industrial complex".They will always find something as justification to suck up 100s of billions on defense over.Never mind that the threat is fabricated.They were lost without the cold war and have now invented the new never ending war with Jihadists.Never mind that the F-22 will really not be very usefull against terrorists,it will be built.Lastly let me say Jhorak I think you are to be commended for being willing to speak of the waste I know you saw as former now retired AF man.Not many would be willing to do that I think.
Apparently, I should have typed Langley AFB instead of Andrews; in my above post.
According to wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-22_Raptor#Production
123 have been ordered, with an additional recent order for 60 more.
I would say, cancel the 60 more and deploy the 123.
But 183 of perhaps the most important conventional warfare category (air superiority fighter) is not too many, all things considered.
But no more unless the world situation changes fairly drastically.
According to wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-22_Raptor#Production
123 have been ordered, with an additional recent order for 60 more.
I would say, cancel the 60 more and deploy the 123.
But 183 of perhaps the most important conventional warfare category (air superiority fighter) is not too many, all things considered.
But no more unless the world situation changes fairly drastically.
Don't forget this. The US needs it's own design Harrier to help out Lockheed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Strike_Fighter
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Strike_Fighter
DrMotorcity
Don Trump calls me Pornography Man
Any means the US government embraces to ensure the safety of this nation and as well to persue the never ending quest to liquidate those who challenge its security is just fine by me.
Hmmm, no routine deterrent carpet-bombing upon no place in particular with in the past ten days? Rats!
Hmmm, no routine deterrent carpet-bombing upon no place in particular with in the past ten days? Rats!
Any means the US government embraces to ensure the safety of this nation and as well to persue the never ending quest to liquidate those who challenge its security is just fine by me.
Hmmm, no routine deterrent carpet-bombing upon no place in particular with in the past ten days? Rats!
I Understand you were not paid for that endorsement or affiliated with any political party in any statements you have made now or in the past.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=SkqlBXEMbEk
DrMotorcity
Don Trump calls me Pornography Man
I Understand you were not paid for that endorsement or affiliated with any political party in any statements you have made now or in the past.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=SkqlBXEMbEk
You understand extremely well; By no means is it pleasure, it is without a doubt strictly business!
:hammer:
Yes a big waste. But what's new?
They still have that joint strike fighter coming out soon? That should be useful fighting the annual wildfires in Southern California.
It makes me wonder also. Wasn't one of the biggest purposes of the JSF to cut the cost it would take to make the planes? At least that was what I was lead to believe. As long as nobody else is coming out with any advanced fighters it makes me wonder why they would develop a new one between what they have now and the future JSF.
About the Joint Strike Fighter.
It's not really a fighter. It's more like an ****** plane with a secondary (though quite capable) air-to-air ability, like present day F-16's and F/A-18's.
It's also a replacement for the Brits and US Marines Harriers - which are again for the most part, ****** planes first and 'fighters' second.
And like the F-16 is much cheaper then the F-15C/D/E, the JSF should be much cheaper then the F-22 (which is really a pure air superiority fighter - like the F-15C/D).
Also, it's development costs have been shared by many countries. And since SO many are planned to be built for so many countries (around 2,400), then individual production costs should be much lower then the Raptor (F-22) at about half per plane.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-35_Lightning_II#Requirement
I am not advocating it's construction necessarily. I am just typing what I read.
It's not really a fighter. It's more like an ****** plane with a secondary (though quite capable) air-to-air ability, like present day F-16's and F/A-18's.
It's also a replacement for the Brits and US Marines Harriers - which are again for the most part, ****** planes first and 'fighters' second.
And like the F-16 is much cheaper then the F-15C/D/E, the JSF should be much cheaper then the F-22 (which is really a pure air superiority fighter - like the F-15C/D).
Also, it's development costs have been shared by many countries. And since SO many are planned to be built for so many countries (around 2,400), then individual production costs should be much lower then the Raptor (F-22) at about half per plane.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-35_Lightning_II#Requirement
I am not advocating it's construction necessarily. I am just typing what I read.
Thats good stuff Mcrocket.I thought they were being built for different roles and beleived as you say the F-22 was some new expensive cutting edge one while the other is to be just a good all around one.But I still say what or who are we countering with these new jets.I mean even if we were to got war with Iran,North Korea,China our present air ***** would overwhelm anything any of them have now and really anything they will have in the foreseable future.I haven't seen any new Migs in a long time.And in the "war on ******" (god I **** that phrase) all this hardware is useless as they don't have air ****** or air defenses to use this stuff on.
its a little excessive
Just as I typed above about the F-22. I think they should continue to develop and test new weapons. But I only think they should build them in small numbers - if at all (of course, they did that with the B-2 Spirit bomber and since they only ended up building 20 or so out of the original 132(?) then the development costs were spread out over many fewer planes and each one ended up costing over $1 BILLION dollars - YIKES!).
I agree that no single country is the remotest match for the United States militarily. And will not be - even if they started spending like mad - for many years. So the US would probably have ample time to ratchet up production on these ultra high tech weapons then.
Unless of course a whole bunch of countries attacked US interests simultaneously. But since the US is not doing anything to **** anyone off then I am sure that this will not be a prob --- er --- never mind.
Facetious
Moderated
A popular radio talk show host once asked : Paraphrasing :
Why America's Armed ****** has by far the most advanced and comprehensive weapons systems - and we refuse to use 'em ?
Ans - To make the Defense Contractor Principals wealthy so they can kick back down $$$ to the deal makin' politicons .
I love them Raptors ! Don't get me wrong ! . . . but being so unique as they are, they (The Contractors) will get their "asking price".
Just F I N A N C E 'em into th' military budget for the next 30 - 40 years !
IIRC - Wasn't the '22 "supposed" to be America's FINAL manned fighter A/C ?
Why America's Armed ****** has by far the most advanced and comprehensive weapons systems - and we refuse to use 'em ?
Ans - To make the Defense Contractor Principals wealthy so they can kick back down $$$ to the deal makin' politicons .
I love them Raptors ! Don't get me wrong ! . . . but being so unique as they are, they (The Contractors) will get their "asking price".
Just F I N A N C E 'em into th' military budget for the next 30 - 40 years !
IIRC - Wasn't the '22 "supposed" to be America's FINAL manned fighter A/C ?
The AF was getting these into there inventory just as I was about to retire from the AF. I spent the majority of my career working F15’s (B52 for my first 3 yrs) The F15 was a Maintenance headache at times but was an overall good fighter, I spent numerous 12 hr shifts at Eglin AFB & Tyndall AFB FL working them just to keep our sortie rates up.
Thanks for all the posts.
Thanks for all the posts.
I Agree 100%
Looks like the US is going back to it's Cold war days with big military contracts.
Peace.
Rock on, USA! Hope our new JSFs can deliver DU cluster-bombs, daisy cutters, MOABs, and the ones that spin and send out crazy bomblets all over the frickin' place. It is only through the use of weapons such as these that real peace can be achieved.
I am proud to be a baby ******* American taxpayer, anybody who disagrees with me is unpatriotic and deserves negative rep action on the FreeOnes bulletin board and a lengthy stay at one of the concentration camps currently under construction in the continental US by KBR.:fight::thumbsup::bowdown::thumbsup::fight:
I am proud to be a baby ******* American taxpayer, anybody who disagrees with me is unpatriotic and deserves negative rep action on the FreeOnes bulletin board and a lengthy stay at one of the concentration camps currently under construction in the continental US by KBR.:fight::thumbsup::bowdown::thumbsup::fight:
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