Steve Jobs Biography Reveals He Told Obama...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...l?icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk2|106075

In one of the most hotly-anticipated biographies of the year, "Steve Jobs," author Walter Isaacson reveals that the Apple CEO offered to design political ads for President Obama's 2012 campaign despite being highly critical of the administration's policies and that Jobs refused potentially life-saving surgery on his pancreatic cancer because he felt it was too invasive. Nine months later, he got the operation but it was too late.

Those are just some of the tidbits about Jobs' life revealed in the upcoming biography, a copy of which was obtained by The Huffington Post. The publication date of the official biography of the notoriously-secretive Apple co-founder was pushed up after his death in October. "I wanted my kids to know me," Isaacson quoted Jobs as saying in their final interview. "I wasn't always there for them and I wanted them to know why and to understand what I did."

Among other details unearthed in the book on the notoriously-secretive Apple co-founder:

Jobs' Meeting With Obama

Jobs, who was known for his prickly, stubborn personality, almost missed meeting President Obama in the fall of 2010 because he insisted that the president personally ask him for a meeting. Though his wife told him that Obama "was really psyched to meet with you," Jobs insisted on the personal invitation, and the standoff lasted for five days. When he finally relented and they met at the Westin San Francisco Airport, Jobs was characteristically blunt. He seemed to have transformed from a liberal into a conservative.

"You're headed for a one-term presidency," he told Obama at the start of their meeting, insisting that the administration needed to be more business-friendly. As an example, Jobs described the ease with which companies can build factories in China compared to the United States, where "regulations and unnecessary costs" make it difficult for them.

Jobs also criticized America's education system, saying it was "crippled by union work rules," noted Isaacson. "Until the teachers' unions were broken, there was almost no hope for education reform." Jobs proposed allowing principals to hire and fire teachers based on merit, that schools stay open until 6 p.m. and that they be open 11 months a year.

Aiding Obama's Reelection Campaign

Jobs suggested that Obama meet six or seven other CEOs who could express the needs of innovative businesses -- but when White House aides added more names to the list, Jobs insisted that it was growing too big and that "he had no intention of coming." In preparation for the dinner, Jobs exhibited his notorious attention to detail, telling venture capitalist John Doerr that the menu of shrimp, cod and lentil salad was "far too fancy" and objecting to a chocolate truffle dessert. But he was overruled by the White House, which cited the president's fondness for cream pie.

Though Jobs was not that impressed by Obama, later telling Isaacson that his focus on the reasons that things can't get done "infuriates" him, they kept in touch and talked by phone a few more times. Jobs even offered to help create Obama's political ads for the 2012 campaign. "He had made the same offer in 2008, but he'd become annoyed when Obama's strategist David Axelrod wasn't totally deferential," writes Isaacson. Jobs later told the author that he wanted to do for Obama what the legendary "morning in America" ads did for Ronald Reagan.

Bill Gates And Steve Jobs

Bill Gates was fascinated by Steve Jobs but found him "fundamentally odd" and "weirdly flawed as a human being," and his tendency to be "either in the mode of saying you were shit or trying to seduce you."

Jobs once declared about Gates, "He'd be a broader guy if he had dropped acid once or gone off to an ashram when he was younger."

After 30 years, Gates would develop a grudging respect for Jobs. "He really never knew much about technology, but he had an amazing instinct for what works," he said. But Jobs never reciprocated by fully appreciating Gates' real strengths. "Bill is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology. He just shamelessly ripped off other people's ideas."

Meeting His Biological Father

Jobs, who was adopted, was a customer at a Mediterranean restaurant north of San Jose without realizing that it was owned by his biological father -- from whom he was estranged. He eventually met his real Dad -- "It was amazing," he later said of the revelation. "I had been to that restaurant a few times, and I remember meeting the owner. He was Syrian. Balding. We shook hands."

Nevertheless Jobs still had no desire to see him. "I was a wealthy man by then, and I didn't trust him not to try to blackmail me or go to the press about it."

Anticipating An Early Death

Jobs once told John Sculley, who would later become Apple's CEO and fire Jobs, that if he weren't working with computers, he could see himself as a poet in Paris. "Jobs confided in Sculley that he believed he would die young, and therefore he needed to accomplish things quickly so that he would make his mark on Silicon Valley history. "We all have a short period of time on this earth," he told the Sculleys. "We probably only have the opportunity to do a few things really great and do them well. None of us has any idea how long we're gong to be here nor do I, but my feeling is I've got to accomplish a lot of these things while I'm young."

* * * * *
For his first interview about the book, Isaacson talked to "60 Minutes" for the Sunday, Oct. 23 episode, telling host Steve Kroft that he was shocked about Jobs's decision to initially skip surgery for his pancreatic cancer -- that such a genius could make such a wrong decision about his own health.

"I've asked [Jobs why he didn't get an operation then] and he said, 'I didn't want my body to be opened ... I didn't want to be violated in that way,' said Isaacson.

"I think that he kind of felt that if you ignore something, if you don't want something to exist, you can have magical thinking. ... We talked about this a lot," he told Kroft. "He wanted to talk about it, how he regretted it. ... I think he felt he should have been operated on sooner."

I guess, with all due regards, he was a bit of a fruitcake. :facepalm:
 
So all we have to do to get more jobs here is to conduct ourselves and treat people, the environment, and the world like China does? :facepalm:

Golly gee, thanks for the advice Jobs. :rofl2:

Of course he's intimately familiar with using Chinese de facto slave labor. It's also nice to blame to teachers like everybody else does for education instead of anybody else, although like everybody else I have yet to hear of a fair way that teachers could ever be judged. I also found it amusingly ironic about what he says about Gates. Not that I like Gates, but Jobs was one of the biggest glory stealers in the technology world leaching off of other people's work and claiming credit and glory for it.

The more people find out about Jobs the more he seems like a douchebag than ever before.

Why do people like the guy? I have a hard time understanding what people see in him.
 
The more I hear about him it seems he was a fruitcake (personally, businesslike) and I see why people dislike him. I respect his business savvy. Whatever. I'm on the Eastside. See me.
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
I think part of what separates people like Steve Jobs, and others like him, from the rest of us is that they are exceptional in many ways. Most of us exist in that big, fat "normal" portion of the bell curve... and that makes us normal. They're not normal. They exist on the outer edges of the bell curve. They see things differently than we do. They perform at levels that we cannot or will not. It's not just that they may be smarter than most of us, they're more driven and/or focused. And one thing all of these people seem to share is a high tolerance for risk and the ability to take a failure and not fold up like a tent in a wind storm.

Henry Ford was one mean ol' SOB. Thomas Edison was weird. Walt Disney was an oddball. Sam Walton was an asshole. Bill Gates apparently suffers from Asperger's Syndrome - as do more than a few of the high tech titans. He also tried to cheat Paul Allen out of his MSFT shares... while the man was fighting a life or death battle with cancer - real sweetheart, that one. Watch Bloomberg "Game Changers" sometimes. Great show. It gives a deeper, broader view of what various modern high performers are really like. And they're not necessarily "nice" boys & girls.

About the only exceptional person that I can think of who doesn't seem to have a (known) weird streak is Warren Buffett. But once he's dead, it'll probably come out that he liked to dress up like a woman or make his wife wear nipple clamps while he spanked her bare ass with a chocolate covered paddle. There'll be something. That "Billionaire Next Door" thing couldn't be 100% accurate. I bet he's at least thought about doing the nasty with Becky Quick or Betty Liu - course, that would just make him "normal". ;)

Personally, I've been a fan of Steve Jobs since I bought my first Apple product back in the mid 80's: a Mac Plus. The guy got fired from the company he founded, learned from that experience and came back to make it the most valuable (by market cap) company in the world - just as it was on the verge of bankruptcy. Not something a "normal" person could do.

Think about all the stories you read about people who get fired from their $40K/year jobs and go shoot the joint up... killing friend and foe in the process. Or some kid who makes a D on an exam and hangs himself. I admire people who can come back from extreme adversity and climb back to the top. Other than my father, two of the people that I most admire are Steve Jobs and Ayrton Senna da Silva. My father was a hard man. Born when men were still men, and not these soft, puffy, crying at the drop of a hat "metrosexuals" that we have now... getting in touch with their feminine sides and going to a therapist to see if their inner children are doing OK. From some of the stories that we're now hearing, apparently Jobs was a hard man. Senna was a hard (and rather strange) man too. On track, he had no mercy. But he also used his money to take care of the poor kids in Brazil. Hard men will get their hands dirty and accomplish things so that the rest of us can live more comfortably. They don't take a step back when things get tough. They don't give up until the day they die. So yeah, I admire that characteristic greatly.
 
I think part of what separates people like Steve Jobs, and others like him, from the rest of us is that they are exceptional in many ways. Most of us exist in that big, fat "normal" portion of the bell curve... and that makes us normal. They're not normal. They exist on the outer edges of the bell curve. They see things differently than we do. They perform at levels that we cannot or will not. It's not just that they may be smarter than most of us, they're more driven and/or focused. And one thing all of these people seem to share is a high tolerance for risk and the ability to take a failure and not fold up like a tent in a wind storm.

Henry Ford was one mean ol' SOB. Thomas Edison was weird. Walt Disney was an oddball. Sam Walton was an asshole. Bill Gates apparently suffers from Asperger's Syndrome - as do more than a few of the high tech titans. He also tried to cheat Paul Allen out of his MSFT shares... while the man was fighting a life or death battle with cancer - real sweetheart, that one. Watch Bloomberg "Game Changers" sometimes. Great show. It gives a deeper, broader view of what various modern high performers are really like. And they're not necessarily "nice" boys & girls.

About the only exceptional person that I can think of who doesn't seem to have a (known) weird streak is Warren Buffett. But once he's dead, it'll probably come out that he liked to dress up like a woman or make his wife wear nipple clamps while he spanked her bare ass with a chocolate covered paddle. There'll be something. That "Billionaire Next Door" thing couldn't be 100% accurate. I bet he's at least thought about doing the nasty with Becky Quick or Betty Liu - course, that would just make him "normal". ;)

Personally, I've been a fan of Steve Jobs since I bought my first Apple product back in the mid 80's: a Mac Plus. The guy got fired from the company he founded, learned from that experience and came back to make it the most valuable (by market cap) company in the world - just as it was on the verge of bankruptcy. Not something a "normal" person could do.

Think about all the stories you read about people who get fired from their $40K/year jobs and go shoot the joint up... killing friend and foe in the process. Or some kid who makes a D on an exam and hangs himself. I admire people who can come back from extreme adversity and climb back to the top. Other than my father, two of the people that I most admire are Steve Jobs and Ayrton Senna da Silva. My father was a hard man. Born when men were still men, and not these soft, puffy, crying at the drop of a hat "metrosexuals" that we have now... getting in touch with their feminine sides and going to a therapist to see if their inner children are doing OK. From some of the stories that we're now hearing, apparently Jobs was a hard man. Senna was a hard (and rather strange) man too. On track, he had no mercy. But he also used his money to take care of the poor kids in Brazil. Hard men will get their hands dirty and accomplish things so that the rest of us can live more comfortably. They don't take a step back when things get tough. They don't give up until the day they die. So yeah, I admire that characteristic greatly.


This should be required reading,
 

georges

Moderator
Staff member
I think part of what separates people like Steve Jobs, and others like him, from the rest of us is that they are exceptional in many ways. Most of us exist in that big, fat "normal" portion of the bell curve... and that makes us normal. They're not normal. They exist on the outer edges of the bell curve. They see things differently than we do. They perform at levels that we cannot or will not. It's not just that they may be smarter than most of us, they're more driven and/or focused. And one thing all of these people seem to share is a high tolerance for risk and the ability to take a failure and not fold up like a tent in a wind storm.

Henry Ford was one mean ol' SOB. Thomas Edison was weird. Walt Disney was an oddball. Sam Walton was an asshole. Bill Gates apparently suffers from Asperger's Syndrome - as do more than a few of the high tech titans. He also tried to cheat Paul Allen out of his MSFT shares... while the man was fighting a life or death battle with cancer - real sweetheart, that one. Watch Bloomberg "Game Changers" sometimes. Great show. It gives a deeper, broader view of what various modern high performers are really like. And they're not necessarily "nice" boys & girls.

About the only exceptional person that I can think of who doesn't seem to have a (known) weird streak is Warren Buffett. But once he's dead, it'll probably come out that he liked to dress up like a woman or make his wife wear nipple clamps while he spanked her bare ass with a chocolate covered paddle. There'll be something. That "Billionaire Next Door" thing couldn't be 100% accurate. I bet he's at least thought about doing the nasty with Becky Quick or Betty Liu - course, that would just make him "normal". ;)

Personally, I've been a fan of Steve Jobs since I bought my first Apple product back in the mid 80's: a Mac Plus. The guy got fired from the company he founded, learned from that experience and came back to make it the most valuable (by market cap) company in the world - just as it was on the verge of bankruptcy. Not something a "normal" person could do.

Think about all the stories you read about people who get fired from their $40K/year jobs and go shoot the joint up... killing friend and foe in the process. Or some kid who makes a D on an exam and hangs himself. I admire people who can come back from extreme adversity and climb back to the top. Other than my father, two of the people that I most admire are Steve Jobs and Ayrton Senna da Silva. My father was a hard man. Born when men were still men, and not these soft, puffy, crying at the drop of a hat "metrosexuals" that we have now... getting in touch with their feminine sides and going to a therapist to see if their inner children are doing OK. From some of the stories that we're now hearing, apparently Jobs was a hard man. Senna was a hard (and rather strange) man too. On track, he had no mercy. But he also used his money to take care of the poor kids in Brazil. Hard men will get their hands dirty and accomplish things so that the rest of us can live more comfortably. They don't take a step back when things get tough. They don't give up until the day they die. So yeah, I admire that characteristic greatly.

Agree with the whole post. Parents of today, are generally irresponsible, weakminded and afraid to take decisions. A lot of parents evade their responsabilities and just make kids in order to receive social helps. Pussification of the society is a trend in a lot of western countries, the lack of values like authority, discipline, disrespect of the elder peers is more and more present today.
 

PlasmaTwa2

The Second-Hottest Man in my Mother's Basement
Isn't it great how people die and suddenly every word they say is treated like it is made of gold? How many other people have talked to Obama about one-term? How many people have talked to him about two terms?
 

georges

Moderator
Staff member
Isn't it great how people die and suddenly every word they say is treated like it is made of gold? How many other people have talked to Obama about one-term? How many people have talked to him about two terms?

With Obama Notrauma, USA has the backwards change or the change up its ass to be very frank and direct. A second term with Obama, no fucking way :nono::noway: and it is totally unconceivable. Obama has cheapened America's core values and destroyed the real values of American culture more or less, he favored the ghetto crowd scum/ghetto culture instead of the hard working citizens, no way in hell that he will be elected a second time. The economical and social outcomes from his presidency are real disasters.
Same with us in France,I will have to vote against that socialist retard of Hollande if I don't want my country to be without a national identity or a ruin.
 

PlasmaTwa2

The Second-Hottest Man in my Mother's Basement
With Obama Notrauma, USA has the backwards change or the change up its ass to be very frank and direct. A second term with Obama, no fucking way :nono::noway: and it is totally unconceivable. Obama has cheapened America's core values and destroyed the real values of American culture more or less, he favored the ghetto crowd scum/ghetto culture instead of the hard working citizens, no way in hell that he will be elected a second time. The economical and social outcomes from his presidency are real disasters.
Same with us in France,I will have to vote against that socialist retard of Hollande if I don't want my country to be without a national identity or a ruin.

You know what else is inconceivable?

Romney in the White House. Or Perry. Or Cain.

Face it, if the best reason your candidate has is that "Amuricans hate the current guy," you are going to make a shitty president. That's not a endorsement of Obama, but a fact. Obama's economic policies are a disaster, but be damn sure that any policies enacted by a Republican President will not make it better. If a Republican President spends all his time trying to undo the damage Obama has done (remember the Democrats are in control of the Senate, so that might not even be an easy job) you are going to see unrest. The American people will not tolerate this anymore, from either party.
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
You know what else is inconceivable?

Romney in the White House. Or Perry. Or Cain.

Face it, if the best reason your candidate has is that "Amuricans hate the current guy," you are going to make a shitty president. That's not a endorsement of Obama, but a fact. Obama's economic policies are a disaster, but be damn sure that any policies enacted by a Republican President will not make it better. If a Republican President spends all his time trying to undo the damage Obama has done (remember the Democrats are in control of the Senate, so that might not even be an easy job) you are going to see unrest. The American people will not tolerate this anymore, from either party.


You dang liberals! Alls we's gots to do is deregulate and cut taxes!

Maybe their system is different in France. But the problem that Georges would have here is that we have no way to vote against someone. Crazy ass us, we have this thing set up so that you're forced to vote for someone.

And I'll be honest with you... though Obama has been something of a disappointment to me thus far, I would give him my last nickel before I would see another war mongering, nation building neocon occupy the White House. It wasn't Obama's supposed socialism/communism/marxism/maoism/MakeSomeMoreWordsUpisms that have put that giant shit sandwich on our plate. Fiscal issues do not turn that fast. Trouble had been brewing for awhile. I actually believe that he's helped more than he's hurt. The trouble is, he hasn't helped all that much. For whatever reason, we're still pretty much at zero sum level. And this I am fairly sure of: had McCain/Palin secured the White House in '08, and Father Time McCain and Caribou Barbie had their way, we would likely be solidly in a full blown depression right now. We wouldn't be talking about Apple Computer or Steve Jobs... cause I doubt most of us would have any electricity anyway!

If the Republicans can come up with someone who I don't think should under psychiatric care, maybe we can talk. Otherwise, present me with Perry, Bachmann or some of these other paranoid schizo freaks, and I will have NO problem voting for Obama again. None! I'll be damned if I'll contribute to another version of George W. Bush EVER getting back in the White House! :hairpull:
 

Supafly

Retired Mod
Bronze Member
Even IF President Obama would favor the very poor, that would be a real nice change, since pretty much every pres before since ages favored the filthy rich.
 
You know what else is inconceivable?

Romney in the White House. Or Perry. Or Cain.

Face it, if the best reason your candidate has is that "Amuricans hate the current guy," you are going to make a shitty president. That's not a endorsement of Obama, but a fact. Obama's economic policies are a disaster, but be damn sure that any policies enacted by a Republican President will not make it better. If a Republican President spends all his time trying to undo the damage Obama has done (remember the Democrats are in control of the Senate, so that might not even be an easy job) you are going to see unrest. The American people will not tolerate this anymore, from either party.
Exactly. Spot-on.

The bottom line is, the country is finished. We've been fighting a "culture war" since the 1960's, and policies enacted by the baby boomer generation under the cloak of "values" or "patriotism" sown the seeds of disaster years ago. It's over. We've already fallen off the cliff, and the only thing that matters now is how hard we hit the bottom.

The great American experiment, in the grand scheme of history, is a failure.
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
Exactly. Spot-on.

The bottom line is, the country is finished. We've been fighting a "culture war" since the 1960's, and policies enacted by the baby boomer generation under the cloak of "values" or "patriotism" sown the seeds of disaster years ago. It's over. We've already fallen off the cliff, and the only thing that matters now is how hard we hit the bottom.

The great American experiment, in the grand scheme of history, is a failure.

Absolutely not!!! You only lose when you give up. This is exactly what I was talking about in the post about Jobs. The British had us beaten several times. But we didn't give up and we were victorious. We made it through the Civil War. We made it through many recessions and depressions, not just the one in the 1930's. So will we take that legacy and fold, or will we put our shoulders to the wheel? Whether or not we have our best days ahead of us depends 100% on the people of this republic. So are we more like Steve Jobs, who walked back into Apple while the lawyers were preparing the bankruptcy paperwork and turned it into the most valuable company in the world, or are we more like that kid I knew in school, who made a D and went home for Christmas break and killed himself???

Here's something that my grandfather told all of his children and it was passed on to me (I don't know if he made it up or if he got it from someone else):
The same heat that melts butter... tempers steel.
 
Absolutely not!!! You only lose when you give up. This is exactly what I was talking about in the post about Jobs. The British had us beaten several times. But we didn't give up and we were victorious. We made it through the Civil War. We made it through many recessions and depressions, not just the one in the 1930's. So will we take that legacy and fold, or will we put our shoulders to the wheel? Whether or not we have our best days ahead of us depends 100% on the people of this republic. So are we more like Steve Jobs, who walked back into Apple while the lawyers were preparing the bankruptcy paperwork and turned it into the most valuable company in the world, or are we more like that kid I knew in school, who made a D and went home for Christmas break and killed himself???

Here's something that my grandfather told all of his children and it was passed on to me (I don't know if he made it up or if he got it from someone else):
The same heat that melts butter... tempers steel.
How quaint. One only needs a basic understanding of history and human nature to know how naive you need to be to believe that. Like the Greeks, Romans, and British before us, our great empire has fallen for good. All of the obstacles you mentioned that we were able to overcome as a country can't mask the many deficiencies and insurmountable differences ingrained in the fabric of our society (race, class, religion, anti-intellectualism, etc.). When you have 70% of people in a particular country who believe Jesus will return in their lifetime, it's over. We should be moving AWAY from religion at a more rapid pace, not holding stronger to it. When you have the majority of people incapable of locating a country we are at war with on a map, but can tell you who won the last 5 Super Bowls, it's over. And when you have large segments of the population angry enough to start a "movement" based on blatant racism, misinformation, and stubborn inflexibility, who support lower taxes on corporations that are robbing them blind, are ignorant to the fact that their own taxes are actually lower than they've been in some time, all while wearing colonial garb... it's over.

Call me cynical, negative, or whatever you want, but as George Carlin would say, We've been circling the drain for a long time.
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
How quaint. One only needs a basic understanding of history and human nature to know how naive you need to be to believe that. Like the Greeks, Romans, and British before us, our great empire has fallen for good. All of the obstacles you mentioned that we were able to overcome as a country can't mask the many deficiencies and insurmountable differences ingrained in the fabric of our society (race, class, religion, anti-intellectualism, etc.). When you have 70% of people in a particular country who believe Jesus will return in their lifetime, it's over. We should be moving AWAY from religion at a more rapid pace, not holding stronger to it. When you have the majority of people incapable of locating a country we are at war with on a map, but can tell you who won the last 5 Super Bowls, it's over. And when you have large segments of the population angry enough to start a "movement" based on blatant racism, misinformation, and stubborn inflexibility, who support lower taxes on corporations that are robbing them blind, are ignorant to the fact that their own taxes are actually lower than they've been in some time, all while wearing colonial garb... it's over.

Call me cynical, negative, or whatever you want, but as George Carlin would say, We've been circling the drain for a long time.

Far from naive. I'm simply a man who actually knows more than just the basics when it comes to Rome and Greece (somewhat). And I have never seen any objective evidence that fate played any part in their rise or decline. Any situation is what one (or a group) makes of it. It doesn't matter if we're talking about an individual, a company or a country. Rome was sacked in 387 BC. But Rome didn't experience any sort of meaningful decline for another 500 years. And it saw the zenith of its influence AFTER the republic fell.

I work with companies which are experiencing difficulties. If you're hitting on all cylinders, you have no need to call a person like me. And the only ones I walk away from (or try to find a quick exit) are the ones where I sense that a significant portion of the workforce has given up. Once you believe that it's all over, I will agree with you - and I will leave you to die in peace... alone. Why would I waste my time on people who have given up? It would have probably been the job of a lifetime to have been at Apple in the mid-late 90's. Probably stressful as hell, but it was probably an experience that one could talk about forever. They were steel. Other companies, the ones that just fold up and the people give up, they're butter. I've gone two days without sleep working with people made of steel. I wouldn't give a "butter man" ten minutes of my time for $10 grand.

And I would say that a LOT more people were firm believers in religion when this nation was formed than now. I don't see that that has anything to do with our supposed decline. We had a LOT more social ills in the 1800's than we do now. It's not like we all got along after the Civil War and now things are so, so bad. And until after WWI, the U.S. was not a true world power anyway. Where we are now, rising or falling, is fairly recent. And who can say that any sort of trend has been established... which cannot be reversed?!

All I can say about this is what I say to people who try to stop me to tell me how much is wrong at some company where I'm doing process improvement work: if you have an idea, talk to me while I walk. Otherwise, if you just want a shoulder to cry on, I'm not that guy. I have work to do.

A problem that I see, many times repeated, is best summed up in this observation by Galbraith:

"Every generation's memory is exactly as long as its own experience."
--John Kenneth Galbraith

Because none of us were alive during the Revolutionary War or the Civil War, we have no idea how bad things were then. And very few of us were alive during the Great Depression. So to us, the slightest bump in the road now all of a sudden becomes "the end of the republic." If we're steel, we'll stand for many more years. If we're (now) butter, the sooner we fall, the better, says I.
 
With Obama Notrauma, USA has the backwards change or the change up its ass to be very frank and direct. A second term with Obama, no fucking way :nono::noway: and it is totally unconceivable. Obama has cheapened America's core values and destroyed the real values of American culture more or less, he favored the ghetto crowd scum/ghetto culture instead of the hard working citizens, no way in hell that he will be elected a second time. The economical and social outcomes from his presidency are real disasters.
Same with us in France,I will have to vote against that socialist retard of Hollande if I don't want my country to be without a national identity or a ruin.


georges knows plenty.
 
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