Israel: Neo-Nazi in the making?

[Iamforever]

you do make an intelligent point fox. but like i said, what they did to the towers. how many people that had NOTHING to do with this war were killed? that is my only point. they bitch that we shove our ideals down their throats? they need a reality check. we dont kill over religion. no matter what you believe in, god does not want anyone to kill in his/her name. period. to use god's name in anything other than love and respect is wrong. it is a copout. i dont support killing, but if they want a jihad they sure as hell will get it. if we had a real leader, this would be over already. but bush's uncle has a contract with the defense department. that means this "war" will go on for a long long time.

 

[georges]

Are you saying we shouldn't see Lebanon or Palestine as a victim because those people support terrorists and radical governments? But that's not true for many Palestinians and most Lebanese, or for the Lebanese government.

When you say "they must be wiped out for good", do you mean those supporting terrorism or just the terrorists? How can you tell which is which? Yes, of course, just bomb the capital city!

Can't you see, some of your "enemies" would say the same thing about Israel and supporters of Isrsel'? Wipe them out, they're wrong, they're evil, they're barbarians, wipe them all out.

Do you remember other times in history when people in power have had views like yours, Georges? Think about it. "Wipe them out." Just think about it. To Hitler, the Jews were evil. So he said, wipe them out. To Milosevic, the ethnic cleansing was thoroughly warranted. Those people deserved to die. Same thing in Rwanda. If you can demonize the enemy, you will eventually sanction "them" being wiped off the planet. And once that happens, all shreds of humanity are lost.

What if "god" gave you what you wanted, and "allah" have an Islamic equivalent of you - someone who wished all Israeli supporters and sympathizers would be wiped off the planet - what you wanted. Sure, the few, the minorities such as you who believe in such mass destruction would be gone. But so would millions of innocent Jewish and Muslim men, women and children in the process. Haven't enough people died on both sides?

Haven't you learned from ALL the blood that has been spilled that when you say "wipe them out" you are no better than the Iranian leader who so horrified you when he said "wipe out Israel"?

I promise you're not the good guys, Georges. You're no more right than your enemies. You have no more right to kill them, terrorists or not, supporters and sympathizers alike, than they have to kill you. In their eyes, you are the terrorists. In unbiased eyes, you are ALL victims. No-one is to blame. But it is hard not to blame those whose rallying cry is "wipe them out"...

Fox

Listen when a government like the hamas or some terrorist groups like Alaksah Martyr Brigades or the FPLP (Popular Front of Freeding Palestine) is responsible of abduction of soldiers, murders of innocent citizens, those people need to be killed. When I saw on newsreports some palestinian kids burning american or israeli or another country flag, I can't say that these people are tolerant and respectful of other nations.
I mean terrorists need to be wiped of for good as well as those who hide them, finance them, support them with food and shelter or by selling them weapons.
The fact is that Jordan and Egypt have a durable peace with Israel and that is important. I am blaming here countries like Iran and Syria. Who are both threats not only to Israel but to other western countries as well. Where does the hezbollah come from? From Iran. Where does Iran buy its armament? From Russia. I am completely against the fact that Iran has a nuclear plant and it must be destroyed as was the Oziraq nuclear plant in Iraq in 1981.
Can we have eternal forgiveness and trust to people who give you a hand and then stab you in the back like the hamas or the hezbollah? No, we can't.
When it is enough it is enough.

 

[pussy+dickdenice]

I was on the fence, but I think I've chosen a side.....

http://img3.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?eb08fa7101.jpg

Thank you Sir.
dd

 

[Togath]

Not the Marines, but the CIA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Beirut_Car_Bombing

It's hard to find such reports given that we're on the side of "god" and "good", but everyone who knows the situation knows the 1985 car bombing was carried out by the CIA.

They were trying to kill one terrorist and his co-conspirators. They failed, but they did manage to kill 80 innocent Lebanese civilians and injure hundreds more.

Some American press reports said the CIA was behind the attack, which was meant to kill Sheikh Fadlallah, who had been accused of supporting the suicide bombers who killed hundreds of US and French troops in attacks on military headquarters in Beirut in 1983 - a charge he has always denied.

Ok it is "supposedly" backed by CIA it doesnt say it is definately, so we dont know. Plus that came after the fact that ther Marines were killed first 2 years before. So there your wrong twice in the same post. I think I see a pattern forming here.

 

[Togath]

Actual no ********** you said, 'Everyone who was there know's it was the CIA". Yeah, just like the U.S. purposely had Osama target the two Towers in New York. I have heard it all before, blame it on the U.S. for starting something.
All I can say is I am glad Isreal is standing up to Hezbollah, and I hope they do run right through Lebanon. I dont see a Jewish sect calling for young people to strap bomb's to thier bodies and target busy area's with civilians. The only type of people I know who are doing present day suicide bombing's are Islamic people. So hmmm, no Hebrew suicide bomber's, no Christian bomber's, no Hindu bomber's....What does that tell me? These uneducated ass backwards countries are pumping out these mindless drones to go and commit suicide attacks. So what does the U.S. and Isreal try and do? They try to go over, educate, and support a democratic society so people wont kill people.
And yes, there is a difference between them and me. For one, if I had a large group of people living in and around me committing suicide attack's. I sure as hell would do something to and about them. I wouldnt let them sit in my house squat in my front yard. No sir, I would be gunning them down with one of thier own soviet made ak47's. So those supposed "innocent's" in Lebonan brought it on themselves by voting into office a terrorist orginization. You can shave a zebra and paint it pink, it's still a freakin zebra!

 

[KittyKat]

Hezbollah does not want "death to Jews" or "death to Christians." Hezbollah - in its more extreme forms - want Jews out of Israel, and the land given to Palestine. It is a LAND dispute. It is not about religion. OUR side of the "war" likes to make it about religion because religion plays such a key role, but you give the Muslims that land, and the bombing will stop. Similarly, if the Arabs stop attacking Israel, Israel will stop killing Arabs. Israel does not want to KILL MUSLIMS (most anyway), and Muslims do not want to KILL JEWS (most anyway), trust me, this is about LAND, TERRITORY, INDEPENDENCE and the difference in wealth... that is what this struggle has always been about.

Just throwing this out there, so Hezbollah want Jews out of Israel? Want to give the land, all the land, to the Palestinians? Do you believe that Hezbollah will agree to a ceasefire without getting what they want - namely all Jews out of Israel?

Forgive me here, but I do believe if there was a ceasefire now, Hezbollah would claim this as a 'victory' over Israel, which would only fuel further incursions by Hezbollah a few months down the line.

 

[voufi]

I am blaming here countries like Iran and Syria. Who are both threats not only to Israel but to other western countries as well. Where does the hezbollah come from? From Iran. Where does Iran buy its armament? From Russia. I am completely against the fact that Iran has a nuclear plant and it must be destroyed as was the Oziraq nuclear plant in Iraq in 1981

Georges, what are you trying to say by this? That for the whole situation in Middle East Syria and Iran is to blame, and Israel is not?I can't and WON'T buy that.And what? You are blaming Russia for selling weapons? Who was selling armament to BinLAden when he was serving their plans? Perhaps the U.S? Check it out a bit.During the Soviet union's war with the Afghans it was the U.S who were backing up BinLAden, but now he is the enemy.
And to you it is fair for Israel to own nukes and for Iran not to?And by wich law it is forbidden for a country to have nuclear power? And who judges that?
Besides nuclear power is not only for war purposes.And if Israel has nukes and Iran doesn't, what's stopping Israel to attack them?What would have happened back in the 50's if the Soviet's had nukes and U.S hadn't? Can you imagine that?

 

[lovejoy]

Go Isreal! Fuck Hesbollah!

I believe this is Day 16th of the War and if you read Jerusalem News, the Israel citizens are asking why the bombs are still falling on their homes and why are they still sleeping in the bunkers.

The Israel citizens are questioning if the Israel Government and the IDF (Israel Defense Force) were ready for the fight after 8 Israel soldiers were killed and 22 were wounded.

This War will open a new frontline for the Muslims to fight against the Jews everywhere in the world (Not just Israel citizens)

This War is going to invite all the radical Muslims to fight against Israel. So Third World War just started 16 days ago !

 

[Togath]

Actually, I heard a polotician on the today show call this the start of the third world war. I cant remember his name as I was headed out the door for work.
And no, I dont believe in killing people. There are two passages in the bible that has always bothered me. One is if one cheek is struck turn the other cheek. Another one say's an eye for an eye. Well roughly thats what they say. I cant remember the exact scripture. My point is this, when is being targeted by muslim extremist's over and over enough? I would have to say Isreal said enough is enough, and I dont blame them. It is sad that they are attacking another country and civilians are getting caught in the cross fire, but mark my word's, if this does break out globally we all are going to get caught in the cross fire.

 

[georges]

Georges, what are you trying to say by this? That for the whole situation in Middle East Syria and Iran is to blame, and Israel is not?I can't and WON'T buy that.And what? You are blaming Russia for selling weapons? Who was selling armament to BinLAden when he was serving their plans? Perhaps the U.S? Check it out a bit.During the Soviet union's war with the Afghans it was the U.S who were backing up BinLAden, but now he is the enemy.
And to you it is fair for Israel to own nukes and for Iran not to?And by wich law it is forbidden for a country to have nuclear power? And who judges that?
Besides nuclear power is not only for war purposes.And if Israel has nukes and Iran doesn't, what's stopping Israel to attack them?What would have happened back in the 50's if the Soviet's had nukes and U.S hadn't? Can you imagine that?

Iran is a danger for the democraties and so is Syria, that is not the case of Israel. I hate Iran as much as I hate Syria alongwith their respective leaders Amazedineijad and Bachar El Assad. Iran is a threat for the western civilisation that is not the case of Irsael, Amazedineeijad is an extremist fucktard and he can't be trusted. I don't trust leaders like Amazedieneijad and Bachar El Hassad. USSR backed up Iraq, Iran, Syria, China, south american coutries and USSR was not the best country where to live at that time.

 

[Baal]

Who gets the Bill???
The international community is correct in its assertion that an immediate cessation of hostilities is the right approach. In what is perhaps a premature topic of conversation, it is plausible to ask who, when the bombings subside and their Israelis withdraw, is going to pay for this mess. Americans heavily invested in Lebanon following the last Israeli withdrawal from its northern neighbor and are now at a loss. The Lebanese, 500,000 of them now refugees in their own country (sound familiar) are also at a loss.

The EU recently gave 40 million dollars in emergency aid and the US gave 10 million in reconstruction efforts but these measures only seek to provide immediate relief and do not address the billions of dollars in damage that have been inflicted upon the government, the economy, and the people of Lebanon. This is the claim of the 21st century, the damages are astonishing and risk factors have risen exponentially. It is very likely that those who thought it was safe to invest in Lebanon will not be making the same mistake twice in a lifetime. Those who wished to take Lebanon 20 years into the past have succeeded in preventing Lebanon from having a prosperous future.

According to the Boston Globe (July 19th 2006), Congress set the price tag for rebuilding Iraq at 30 billion and a top US auditor said that an additional 50 billion was needed to rebuild Iraq's oil facilities and electrical grids. Iraqis and Lebanese have a lot in common these days, the majority of the damage caused in their nations was done by sophisticated weaponry originating in the United States. Where is the Israeli Colin Powell; where are their congressional counterparts in the Knesset who should be standing up and saying, "You break it, you own it."

There has been absolutely no debate on this subject because US politicians are too crooked and scared to forgoe what side their bread is buttered on and do the right thing for this country!!

Israel should not be exempt from its liability for the damage it has wrought in Lebanon, and the West Bank and Gaza for that matter. It is time for Israel to grow up and pay up. No one in this world should be allowed the luxury of sowing such staggering destruction without reaping the costs. What is surprising is the sheer lack of debate on the subject, until now. It is unlikely that America or Europe will willingly foot the bill for rebuilding Beirut, Tyre, Sidon as well as compensate the half million (potentially more) refugees. The Arab world is less likely to help and as it stands, the entire region is poised on a Sunni - Shi'a faultline, ready to ignite.

If I was President Siniora, I wouldn't just plead for a ceasfire, I'd send Olmert the bill.

 

[lordvader1]

Actual no ********** you said, 'Everyone who was there know's it was the CIA". Yeah, just like the U.S. purposely had Osama target the two Towers in New York. I have heard it all before, blame it on the U.S. for starting something.
All I can say is I am glad Isreal is standing up to Hezbollah, and I hope they do run right through Lebanon. I dont see a Jewish sect calling for young people to strap bomb's to thier bodies and target busy area's with civilians. The only type of people I know who are doing present day suicide bombing's are Islamic people. So hmmm, no Hebrew suicide bomber's, no Christian bomber's, no Hindu bomber's....What does that tell me? These uneducated ass backwards countries are pumping out these mindless drones to go and commit suicide attacks. So what does the U.S. and Isreal try and do? They try to go over, educate, and support a democratic society so people wont kill people.
And yes, there is a difference between them and me. For one, if I had a large group of people living in and around me committing suicide attack's. I sure as hell would do something to and about them. I wouldnt let them sit in my house squat in my front yard. No sir, I would be gunning them down with one of thier own soviet made ak47's. So those supposed "innocent's" in Lebonan brought it on themselves by voting into office a terrorist orginization. You can shave a zebra and paint it pink, it's still a freakin zebra!

Damn good post:thumbsup:

 

[pussy+dickdenice]

Actual no ********** you said, 'Everyone who was there know's it was the CIA". Yeah, just like the U.S. purposely had Osama target the two Towers in New York. I have heard it all before, blame it on the U.S. for starting something.
All I can say is I am glad Isreal is standing up to Hezbollah, and I hope they do run right through Lebanon. I dont see a Jewish sect calling for young people to strap bomb's to thier bodies and target busy area's with civilians. The only type of people I know who are doing present day suicide bombing's are Islamic people. So hmmm, no Hebrew suicide bomber's, no Christian bomber's, no Hindu bomber's....What does that tell me? These uneducated ass backwards countries are pumping out these mindless drones to go and commit suicide attacks. So what does the U.S. and Isreal try and do? They try to go over, educate, and support a democratic society so people wont kill people.
And yes, there is a difference between them and me. For one, if I had a large group of people living in and around me committing suicide attack's. I sure as hell would do something to and about them. I wouldnt let them sit in my house squat in my front yard. No sir, I would be gunning them down with one of thier own soviet made ak47's. So those supposed "innocent's" in Lebonan brought it on themselves by voting into office a terrorist orginization. You can shave a zebra and paint it pink, it's still a freakin zebra!

Thank you Togath for your view.

No, I don't blame US for starting something if it really is not true. After the fall of USSR, look at the world and you will find rays of targets towards USA.

Why you know? US used forces of Taliban like units to force USSR in to an indirect fight. In case of Talibans, US directly supplied arms and ammos through Pak. Now those same sources are being used to spread terror in that area.

But after USSR, these forces were dispensable to USA. They stopped funding them and almost all of them turned against.

Now Israel is a convinient excuse to keep a toe hold in that region and that too because of smooth flow of oil.

Just have a look at history of that period and then comment. And I will believe you. The twin tower tragedy in my opinion is USA's own making. It was the general people of US, hardworking, nice & fun loving people, who actually suffered and their anger targeted the easiest source as the enemy but not the actual culprits. The media played a great part in it too.

 

[pussy+dickdenice]

Brought it up again. Look at this.

A few Lines:
"Israeli missiles struck a southern Lebanese village today killing about 50 civilians – half of them children – when the building they sought refuge in collapsed."

"In Qana, a three-storey building took a direct hit on the residential edge of the village. The dead were elderly men and women and children from four families who residents said spend the night on the ground floor where they felt they were safe from the bombardment.

Rescuers aided by villagers were digging by hand to look for casualties."

I hope THEY were not called Terrorists.

dd

 

[KungFuDude]

Believe me:

If you are one of those people who supports this military action by Israel, then every one of these children who dies... every innocent... their blood is on your hands. Just like, if you support the violent actions of Hezbollah and Al Quaeda, than the blood of their victims is also on your hands. This is absolutely no different, don't kid yourself.

If you think you're neutral or indifferent, or that you're American and this has nothing to do with you... here's something else:

If you supported the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the offensive military action, then every innocent life lost is also on your hands. However, you may think there were not that many innocents killed by American troops in those two wars. But consider this: the media has full access to Lebanon. They can see everything. In Iraq and Afghanistan, we have no idea how many innocents were killed by American forces. The media were never allowed to see anything, and were handed "west-friendly" Iraqis on a plate to interview.

That last sentence is not entirely true fox. American and British forces had imbedded reporters in virtually every unit in the field during the Iraq war. The media was allowed more access to that war than any other before it. I'm sure they didn't see everything, but they reported on everything they did see. Which was a whole lot of bad stuff that many of the Generals and politicians would have normally liked to keep hush-hush. They specifically put those reporters there to show the world what was really going on.

As far as this current war goes, I'm not entirely on Israel's side, but I'm sure as hell not on Hezbollah's side a.k.a. Syria/Iran. Israel seems to be somewhat dictating America's foreign policy in the region at the moment. That I don't support at all. End the war Israel. You made your point. Stop dragging all of us into this nonsense.

 

[FullMoonWolf]

Why can't there be a "No-Kill Zone" reserved for innocents? Has anyone thought of this? All the innocent men, women and children could come forward and be directed into a reserved area of the state. There, shelter would be provided, health care and food. Then at least they are out of the way.

 

[lordvader1]

Believe me:

If you are one of those people who supports this military action by Israel, then every one of these children who dies... every innocent... their blood is on your hands. Just like, if you support the violent actions of Hezbollah and Al Quaeda, than the blood of their victims is also on your hands. This is absolutely no different, don't kid yourself.

If you think you're neutral or indifferent, or that you're American and this has nothing to do with you... here's something else:

If you supported the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the offensive military action, then every innocent life lost is also on your hands. However, you may think there were not that many innocents killed by American troops in those two wars. But consider this: the media has full access to Lebanon. They can see everything. In Iraq and Afghanistan, we have no idea how many innocents were killed by American forces. The media were never allowed to see anything, and were handed "west-friendly" Iraqis on a plate to interview.

The WHO (I think) has a running tally of estimated deaths in Iraq, which is in the tens of thousands. Deaths from attacks by American troops: between 1 and 2000. This could well be a low estimate. So that's a shitload of lives on our hands, as Americans. If you don't want blood on your hands, stand up and shout and protest against unjust war. And if you want the truth, there is no such thing as a just war. War should only ever be "enacted" in self-defence. The aggressor is always wrong. Having weapons and talking shit is not an act of war. Bombing and killing is.

In that respect the Israeli war has been going on for a long, long time. Israel just decided to step it up a bit...

Fox

Well I guess my hands are red because I fully support my troops trying to rid the world of people like Hussein, Bin Laden, Zarqawi, etc. I also remember you saying in other post that you were English so how can you say "So that's a shitload of lives on our hands, as Americans." Your not a fucking American and I'm getting so goddamn sick and tired of you ripping this country for every single "innocent life" lost on the planet. I've said it before and I'm proud to say again that our men and women serving in this war our true heroes and people like you who bash them for trying to make the world safe because a few women and children got killed which I just don't give a shit about disgust me. Aren't you Iranian too? I'll bet if Israel bombed the shit our of your families hometown and you lost somebody close your peace loving ways would disolve pretty damn quick. You'd probably jump on the whole Muslim Jihad bandwagon and call for the utter destruction of Israel and the US too.
You speak of innocent lives lost. What about the soldier who devotes his life to the military and serving his country with pride. Are you saying he deserves to die because he's taking up arms against his fellow man? What about his family that will never see him again, what do you have to say to them? Would you be able to look a little girl in the face and tell her that her daddy dead because he's a cold blooded killer. A killer who's trying to protect her from animals who want her dead because of where she lives or her religion. Shit, and you've told me that I'm a hatemongerer!!! You need to think about what you're typing sometimes man because you make yourself out to be a fool. It's pretty obvious that you hate the United States and all that we stand for but for christs sake man use your brain.
The absolute 1 thing that I do agree with you on is that I do want WWIII to be over asap. I don't want anymore of my troops killed or more of our building destroyed but your fooling yourself. All of you are if you think this will be over soon. Hezbollah, Al Queada and whatever other Arab terrorist group are fighting a Jihad against us and Israel. A holy war, they've said it publically in their little videos they make so you can't deny it. They absolutely will not stop until we are all dead or all of them are dead. Condy and the UN cannot sit down at a table and resolve this matter. It's going to be dealt with on the battlefield and we're just gonna have to accept that. More people will die it's inevitable at this point. Some of you may not like it but it's just what's staring us in the face.

 

[D-rock]

Why can't there be a "No-Kill Zone" reserved for innocents? Has anyone thought of this? All the innocent men, women and children could come forward and be directed into a reserved area of the state. There, shelter would be provided, health care and food. Then at least they are out of the way.

In a war between civilized nations that would strictly follow the rules of warfare it might work, but anything like that would just be used by the terrorist as a tactical advantage. Just like they use their supposed fellow citizens as human shields and just like they will hide in some masque to they can use the propaganda effect when they force their enemies to attack it. The fact they do things like that isn't just coincidence, it's a deliberate line of thought that they go through and they know how to play that strategy from the bottom of the deck. Of course if they really cared about God, and doing what's right they probably wouldn’t use other people for their own gain, but hypocrisy isn't beyond them either.


**********, let me say this. I think in your own way you’re a nice person with a good heart, and I think all your intentions are in the right place. However in other ways I have meet few people that stick their head in the sand more than you do. Sometimes I wonder if we live in the same reality. There is a saying, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". I think that describes what you say pretty well. While I think you might have a good heart I would never want anybody like you to control or run anything important. Even if 99.99% of the world were pacifistic, people like you would always be condemned to be ruled over by the .01% that wasn't. You would lead everything to ruin because you would wait around while the people around you ended up dying or you would always insist on talking about it with people that have no intention of listening. All your enemies will hide behind innocent people because they know you will never do anything that might harm them. They will win as you have no hope, and they will sit there and laugh at you as they kill you and you do nothing. Sooner or later there comes a point where people have to defend themselves. I find worse the person that will let others die because he is too afraid to do anything, then the person that unfortunately might have to end up inadvertently killing civilians because or the randomness or war or the fact they are human shields.


As far as paying for rebuilding a country that I would have to go to war with...NO WAY. If somebody makes me go to war with them it is their fault. If I have to pay to rebuild the other country, I'm owning it. It is simple as that. In fact before I would ever rebuild them I would take money away form them that I lost do to the war. I might only make an exception if the people and the government after it are straitened up like Germany post WWII. Then they would still probably have to pay me back. To just give money to your enemies after they forced you to attack them so they can sit there and rebuild, that is foolish in every sense of the word. I say if they want money to rebuild ask Hezbollah. If they don't like that then they sure as hell better take care of the problem before I have to take care of it for them.

 

[Member2019]

Not the Marines, but the CIA.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Beirut_Car_Bombing

And in what year were the US Marine barracks bombed? Chronology is everything -- especially given the fact that the US Marines were there as a part of a UN peacekeeping operation.

It was after those sequence of events the Reagan administration decided that forgo traditional combation units and use the CIA. Because they weren't dealing with a government, but a terrorist state controlling the government.

People need to ask themselves, why are civilians dying? Really? Resolution 1559 states specifics. Unfortunately, just like most UN resolutions, various nations apply them in whatever way suits them.

But I know most of you won't pay any attention to such details as "chronology" or resolutions that state -- gasp -- that Lebanon must disarm and control their own people, or Israel is free to defend itself. 6 years and thousands of rockets later (before the soldiers were kidnapped), Israel decided to enforce Resolution 1559.

But, just like the Iraq cease-fire that was utterly forgotten 12 years later when the US enforced the terms of the cease-fire in 2003, Resolution 1559 has been forgotten 6 years later when Israel did the same.

 

[4G63]

Why can't there be a "No-Kill Zone" reserved for innocents? Has anyone thought of this? All the innocent men, women and children could come forward and be directed into a reserved area of the state. There, shelter would be provided, health care and food. Then at least they are out of the way.

Didn't Hitler do that? Then kill all of the "refugees". IMO if you put all the innocents in one place it just makes it easier for the opposition to kill the work force of the nation they are fighting.

I don't agree with everything D-rock said, but I know that if an enemy tried to "take over" America, the citizens would not run but fight. That's why War is terrible, it turns normal people into killers and children into "terrorists".

Also IMO War is the ultimate expression of schizophrenic mass delusion. It's like Mob Rule, once it get's going nothing can escape and all bets are off. This War will only spawn more Wars and more "terrorists".